Great job Connor! Awesome work!

Great Work

Hopefully no one destroys the kid like they did to rhabdo

Nicely done Connor...

I just wanted to ask a question. Why is it everytime someone does something amazing in the crossfit community we feel obligated to critique every little detail of their accomplishment? It's not like we don't have enough haters in the fitness community already, but to be sniped by our own sucks. I understand the concept of viturosity and all that it implies, but damn, ease up. A great effort is a great effort. Let's celebrate that, instead of ripping people and their accompiishments apart. Until Crossfit becomes more standardized, let's just enjoy the ride and the challenge the community provides. Just a thought.

beastly Fran Connor

Rhabdo is top notch, but his 1:53 wasn't to standard and never give yourself a nickname.

So glad tomorrow is a rest day. Nice job Connor.

Me strong like bull, dumb like tractor.

Here's the deal for me.

I have noticed some right leaning on the Crossfit rest days as well. Makes no difference to me. I love the training, it provides a challenge, and that's why I love it!

The Glassman's can post what ever they want for rest day articles. We can feel free to agree or disagree, that's what makes our country so great. As long as they keep producing cutting edge fitness; I'll keep coming back.

I'm just happy to be here. Nice rip Connor

Conner, you're a beast! Can't wait to shake your hand at the CF Games. You're quite an inspiration to both kids and adults.

Is it just me or does anyone else's week not feel complete until they've listened to CrossFit Radio?

Connor, awesome job, Perfect form, insane time, one workout closer to to the 2009 crossfit games.

Good job, Connor !

Anyone know how old Connor is and how long he's been Crossfit training ?

About the rest day articles:

If you take them as gospel, you are an idiot. If you take them as the writing of the Anti-Christ, you are also an idiot and probably think that preacher curls are the best way to build biceps. If you are able to read an article with a different opinion than your own and provide an intelligent response that might even differ from the article's conclusion, then you have finally understood the CrossFit philosophy.

Hmmm, my first post got lost. Congrats and huge ups to Connor Martin, 17 year old role model. Son of Jeff and Mikki Martin of BrandX, product of CF Kids. Wish you all could have seen him at the 2008 Games.

Front page! Nice job, young man.

The right leaning articles do not bother me, as they do spark lively debates. I just do not appreciate those who will pretend that the majority of the articles are not consertive/ right wing in nature. I think that may be what bothers many of us (mostly speaking for myself) who are more liberal in their political views and frequent the website on rest days. Just be honest about the nature of the articles and we can go from there.

First of all, I used to be proud of my 3:05 Fran. Now that a 16 year old is demolishing my time I realize it's time to redouble my efforts and get down to the low 2's. This pattern happens a lot with crossfit: 1. work hard 2. succeed, 3. see someone much better than you 4. work harder 5. succeed again 6. get humbled again.

Secondly, I think that my article from http://www.insurgentconsciousness.typepad.com/ is likely to "start something":

Information Access Superiority

Terrorists are easy to kill, but hard to find.

Imagine that you are an American soldier in Iraq in 2005. You spend much of your time patrolling the streets on foot and in jeeps. Your military uniform gives your identity away immediately. You most likely don't speak the local Arabic dialect, so you don't know what anyone around you is saying. You can only communicate through hand signals or an interpreter, if you have one. The Iraqis know you are coming from a mile away.

You can't tell who the enemy is and who is a civilian. You most likely don't know where the insurgents are, or when they're going to attack you. Meanwhile, the insurgents have learned your rules of engagement and tactics, and have come to anticipate your movements. They can ambush you at will, but often they would rather just mine the road you ride on every day with I.E.D.'s.

One day you discover that someone has placed a $10,000 reward on your head. Your enemies, who are faceless to you, have been photographing your unit and have begun to piece together your organizational structure.

You are in a state of information access inferiority. If you could just face these insurgents on the battlefield, you could overwhelm them with your superior firepower and better training. But most of the time you're getting sucker-punched by weaker forces who instead of having conventional military superiority, have the advantage in the amount and quality of information that they can access.

The side with information access superiority has the advantage in unconventional warfare. Information access superiority is also a necessary prerequisite for successful special operations, a category that, in our opinion, includes terrorist attacks.

Information access superiority has three components:

1. Environmental Information Access – You know more about the human and natural environment than the enemy knows.

2. Access Relative to Enemy– Your know more about the enemy than the enemy knows about you.

3. Undiscovered Information Access– You have access to information that the enemy isn't aware that you have.

Information access inferiority is the biggest obstacle facing the United States in the 21st century security environment. It is the reason that the U.S. has been unable to destroy the Al Qaeda and Taliban safehaven in Pakistan. This safehaven is the main reason that the U.S. is still fighting struggling with the insurgency in Afghanistan.

The U.S. does not lack the material ability to blow up targets in the Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) of Pakistan; it has predator drones that can destroy any target in the region, as it has repeatedly demonstrated. The U.S. lacks the information access necessary to destroy Al Qaeda central.

In many areas such as the FATA, where terrorists have avoided our attempts at signal intelligence, information access superiority is only possible through human sources. In this field, the United States is especially weak. We will discuss the development of human sources at length in a later post.

sweet i started something

Way to go Connor!

E & R watched the video and said "Whoa....Connor rocks!" :)

Awesome job Connor!! The whole family was cheering you on! Way to represent the teenagers :)
Can't wait to see the Martin family again!

Great work Connor!!

Nice work, Connor buddy! Now after that can we elevate him from the 'kids' status?

Strong work Conner! Impressive Fran time. Conner is all of 16 years old.

"Start something in comments."

Now it won't be as fun to start something, since all the people normally upset by opinions know they are coming.

I will wait until the awareness dies down a bit.

Expect the unexpected.

I'm liberal who proudly supported Gore, Kerry and Obama and thinks the National Review is twaddle. I've opposed the Iraq War since it began and thought Sarah Palin the most ignorant and idiotic national candidate in modern times.

I also think any attempt to tie a particular fitness program with successful governance is silly. I could just as well argue CrossFit is a metaphor for communism, given, for example, its reliance upon a central source of dogma. The whole mental exercise is silly. Fitness is no better a metaphor for governance than is painting or carpentry or essay writing or network server configuration.

That said, the articles don't do anything to interfere with the free resource I enjoy here. If anything, my biggest criticism of the articles is that I think they hurt CrossFit by potentially turning off possible new members. How big is that effect? Beats me. Could be zero. In general, though, businesses are discouraged from raising politics because it's likely to alienate some and unlikely to bring others in.

But that's Glassman's call. So, that's where this free-riding liberal who uses the free WOD as often as he can, as well as the video demos (and who would do CrossFit at a certified gym, or would buy CrossFit products, if he had the time or the real need) comes down. I only occasionally skim the comments or boards, so I can't say if the politics pollutes the dialogue, though from what I've seen that's not the case. If Glassman wants to interject some of his beliefs (which, truth be told, I think are stupid, as I've found most of the linked articles to be stupid) into his free resource, then more power to him. It's his right.

Connor - AWESOME work !!!!

and to think he is more than half my age with a minute better

Thought I'd "start something" as requested (although all of my posts are mysteriously being held)...

President-elect Obama has a portrait of Lincoln in his office. He speaks of Lincoln as his muse. He has wondered what that portrait of Lincoln might ask him.

Lee Siegel in 11/15/08 WSJ: "Insofar as Lincoln had ideas about the society and the politics of his day, his questions would have left Mr. Obama disappointed. Lincoln was a boot-strap individualist, who believed that the free market offered the most opportunities to the most people, provided that they had the willpower and ambition. His domestic positions would have fitted nearly seamlessly in the Republican Party of today. Though Lincoln was kind and rich in empathy himself, he would not have cast a sympathetic eye toward redistributing wealth between lucky rich and unlucky poor."

While it makes for compelling narrative and elegant politics, might the implied similarity between the divisions of Lincoln's day and those of which President-elect Obama speaks today be somewhat of a reach?

Sick work Conner...It doesnt really matter b/c it was awesome, but was that Rx'd 95#????

I think my favorite point of both sides of this article is that they both aknowledge the fact that this site is owned by the Glassmans and they can do what ever the hell they want, debate is good and if you don't like it then you have the right to piss off. (or should I say- 'don't participate in the rest day discussion if it pisses you off'?)

In honor of the new Bond film, I present an article for Rest Day discussion: http://artofmanliness.com/2008/11/13/6-lessons-in-manliness-from-james-bond/

Connor, your work ethic and dedication is inspiring to us all. I look forward to continue to watch you progress and grow as a young man. Great model you are to the CrossFit community and especially to other kids your age.
Keep up the great work,
Steve

I don't see Crossfit in any idealogical camp - Conservative, Libertarian, whatever. To me it is utilitarian - simple, effective, and based on solid principles. In essence, it could be said that Crossfit is the thinking person's fitness tool. And for that reason, as a thinking person, I enjoy the back and forth on rest days. It is a chance for this community of fitness seekers to have discourse in a non-fitness dimension; for thinking people to interchange ideas with people with whom they would never otherwise interact. Sometimes I even gain insights from people who otherwise would have been out of my small network. Imagine that.

I like CrossFit. I'm PRO-Bush; PRO-Prop 8 (thank God California has more God fearing people then God haters); PRO-war (because without war, there is no peace, only evil dictatorships); and I believe that faith in Jesus Christ is the only way to stay out of Hell.

So there!

I hate liberals, rock on Lauren and Greg.

Here is what kills me.

I see professionals’ hunting each other down over what is right and what is wrong on topics such as fitness, nutrition and general health. Some sighting tests, experiments, and data that enforces their particular view point. WTF, people, when both sides of an issue have what they believe is sound data, shouldn't someone call the BS flag and say, “Hey! People lets get to the bottom of this freaking mess and produce truths.” Is a no carb diet good or bad? Is the metabolic conditioning that Crossfit promotes sane? Is fat really bad for you? These are just a few of thousands of questions that for some damn reason have people on both sides arguing their point with data. Yet, the confusion still exists.
So now, we get the "well, do the research yourself and make your own opinion." I am not a doctor, nor a scientist, nor a nutritionist, nor a micro-cellular biologist, nor a personal trainer, hell; I am not even the guy who mops up the gym floor. I can’t remotely understand the science jargon when I look at the data that presents a scientific case (Google/Scholar is a wonderful tool). So, I rely on specialist to provide the proof and explain it to me. But this brings me back to the first paragraph, more confusion.
So, I do the best I can. I look at both arguments of an issue and weigh my judgment to their professional opinion. Somewhere in the mess, I produce a choice and a reason for it. Will my choice be different then someone else’s… God, I sure hope so.

So, until the brains can come together and stop acting like opposing team soccer fans, my choice will be my choice. Man! You gotta love this place.

By the way, the three most talked about subjects in the world are Sex, Politics and Religion. Go for it!

I've always identified very strongly with libertarian and anarchist views. I never thought of it until now that it could be a subliminal reason I like CF so much. It's all about hard work, self-reliance (but helping others out of the good of your heart), and freedom to choose new things. Conservativism and liberalism are not contrarian in our society, but libertarianism is. Similarly in our society, Crossfit takes an unpopular but rational and logical approach to fitness.

I like political discussions but I'd much rather talk about college football, ping pong or skateboarding. Go Huskers!

I've been enjoying crossfit for almost a year and it has helped give me a new appreciation for my body and what it can do. I belong to a local affiliate and have had fun working with them. The community atmosphere has been incredible.

As far as the political discussions, they have been interesting, but as a doctoral candidate studying political science I have been more blown away by the model of governance here at crossfit. There is not one model; there are clearly two that operate simultaneously.

The WODS are promulgated via crossfit.com, a centralized location. Passionate individuals take the WODS and carry out their orders. This is one governing structure. The other, it could be argued, is more innovative.

The affiliates pay a fee and learn the fundamentals of the philosophy (or ideology) of crossfit. They then work on that ideology in real-time with their clients adapting the approach to individual needs. In doing so they cross-communicate to develop new WODS and approaches to physical fitness. Communications between these ‘scientists of crossfit’ occur at the main site and across affiliates. Correct me if I am wrong, but this has been a great site of excitement and innovation for Crossfit.

One problem that I see is that this second more dynamic mode of governance has yet to be fully integrated into the more centralized main site. This has become increasingly more of an issue as the number of affiliates across the world has grown, and the issue of quality or what 'is' the true crossfit starts to become discussed in certain corners of the community. However, addressing this difficulty could 'kill' the ingenuity that the affiliates have contributed in the name of crossfit.

This last point is truly the problem of libertarians and, actually, communists. Libertarians argue that this integration should never occur. This maybe a good point, but they cannot account for the centralized governing structure that helped birth and bring a sense of community to the decentralized and dispersed second governing structure. A true libertarian would call for the end to the main site. A communist, on the other hand, would ask for ways to integrate the two such that they become one. The most common way to achieve this in the real world has been a call for greater centralization, which crushes the innovation.

I am interested to see in the future, in a hypothetical post-Glassman world, what will happen to the two governing structures that now exist in the community. I can only hope that the same success that I have achieved physically will be achieved by the community regarding this issue.

Congratulations Connor...that is awesome!

re: The post-Glassman Crossfit World

The nightmare scenario is what happened in the Lubavitch sect of Judasm after the Rebbe (Schneerson) died: chaos over succession, legacy, and legitimacy issues.

#1. If there are any people who are going to say, "Can we just keep Crossfit fitness related and not politics?" I have this much to say: start your own damn website or don't check out the links on rest days if it's going to get your panties in a bunch. Frankly, if you don't stimulate the mind as well as the body God gave you, you're insulting the Creator who blessed you.

#2. As for the read, I liked it. In the read a question was asked as to whether taxing the top 1% is a good idea.

I have to say no. The reason I say no is quite a bunch-fold.

First, our nation was not built on taxing people in the manner we've only been doing for 91 years of our history, yet we were doing great even back then.

Second, I have a real problem with anyone taking my money yet not doing the work. I do favor a federal sales tax, but that's about it.

Think about it. You pay a utility tax, a property tax, a gas tax, an income tax, a penalty tax, a death tax (sometimes), a capital gains tax: when the heck does it end.

However, H.R. 25, the FairTax bill, while it still takes a lot of money away from the Americans, it does so in a fair way: you only pay taxes when you by new goods and services. This puts you more in charge of how you're going to pay your taxes and makes the government have to wait.

There are two things to check out:

1) fairtax.org

2) video.google.com "America: From Freedom to Fascism." It's a movie by Aaron Russo and it does take some time to watch, but it is VERY interesting.

Kris

Mixing politics and crossfit is like, whatever dude.

Awesome job, Connor!

Connor is 17, a young man now and no longer a kid. A young man the caliber of which both his parents are very proud.
But he was one of the first CrossFit Kids starting CF at 13. He is the "product", the outcome,
of one of the first black box CFK trials, hence the label "CrossFitKid". I believe he is proud to have that title.
Great work son.

Connor, you have always been a young man that I look up too. Great job bro.

#37- Huh?

I have finally come across a philosophy that I can relate to that I would actually have tattooed on myself.

'Live Dangerously'

In the late 1800's, German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche said that morality was a system of judgments that coincided with the conditions of the moralist's life. There was a master morality and a slave morality. People who could assimilate the will to power would survive, be honest about the aggressive instinct, become leaders, and determine what is good and what is evil. The greatest enjoyment, Nietzsche said, was to "live dangerously," in other words to live on one's own terms.

Both Sigmund Freud and Carl Jung admired Nietzsche's work 'Beyond Good and Evil'. Unfortunatly, so did such people as Hitler and several serial killers who twisted his ideas to suit their own.

Crossfit is certainly developing my physical ability to live dangerously, thank you. My mental superiority is already in place.

(I am very joking about that last bit)

Strong work Connor!

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasure. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship.

The average age of the world's great civilizations has been two hundred years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence: from bondage to spiritual faith, from spiritual faith to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependency, from dependency back to bondage." -- Alexander Tyler

I post this only because CF's approach to functional fitness can be compared to a rescue from traditional fitness training techniques (AKA bondage). I am far from an avid CFter. I believe in the higher concept of functional fitness, and do appreciate the CF methodology. I have referred hundreds of people to the mother site, as it proves to be the most complete of any resource out there for functional fitness. I enjoy the camaraderie, but am frequently disturbed by the close-mindedness of some CultFitters.

I see some purist CFters falling into the sorry states of apathy and dependency...believing nothing other than what is posted on the CF mother site and in the CFJ. I applaude those of you who do challenge CF's views and stances. CF is not the end-all, and there is more operating outside CF that is still true.

Without focus on the main mission (to bring functionality to fitness), this community sets itself up for future failure from within. It is OK to disagree with the mother site. It is OK to have opinions for yourself. That's one of the strengths of democracy...many paths to the destination. When CFters knock other forms of functional fitness, they bite the hand that feeds them.

With that being said, thank you CF for all you have done within the functional fitness community. I and others owe so much of our success to you and the community you breed.

Connor "Fire-Breathing" Martin, you're getting OLD man, you 17 yet?

I love CF because, for the most part, we gladly mix our views outside of CF for the sake of community. I am a Christian Conservative and hold those views because of careful consideration of values, not because of a party line. I believe liberal views, while held honorably by their keepers, are misguided and patronizing. However, I thoroughly enjoy the company of fellow CrossFiters who hold these views as dear to them as I hold mine. We can co-exist.

It's called mutual respect, and if this country had more of it, we'd get a lot more accomplished for the mutual good of everyone. Disagreeable people unfortunately hold positions high within our media and government and therefore contrarianism for the sake of contrarianism rules the day. This happens from both angles, right and left. The right points to the left and screams, and the left points back and screams.

One thing I wish more conservatives and liberals would understand is that tolerance does not have to mean acceptance. And just because it's "legal" doesn't necessarily make it "right".

I am happy to call CrossFit my family, and just like family, you do not have to accept the views of fellow CrossFitters, you just have to tolerate them. If I cannot tolerate the political view of a fellow CrossFitter, how can I ever coach them? How can they trust me as a trainer?

Comment #25 - Bingo

The economic ideas that Lincoln and many others supported after the Civil War lead to the great depression.

The same free market thinking has put us into a horrible economic crisis today.

There is a good reason Lincoln isn't known for his economic policies.

COMMENT 31! YOU GO, I AM WITH YOU 110%. DESPITE SHORTCOMING IN SOME AREAS BUSH HAS DONE AN AMAZING JOB OF PROTECTING OUR NATION FROM THE REAL AND EVER PRESENT TERROIST THREAT!

ROM - does anyone still know what that means?

mtschanz-#50

Amen Brother!

Connor

I have no doubt that whatever educational, professional, or personal endeavors you aspire to achieve will be realized with honors. My only regret is that like you I didn't learn the physical and mental fitness of CrossFit at such a young age. Please keep us posted on your personal accolades, I'm sure there will be many.

To Mr. and Mrs. Martin
I could only hope that my three daughters have the work ethic and physical/mental toughness that your son displays on this site. I know you are proud, and should be. Thanks for the inspiration to be a better parent and man.

I love the political commentary. YOUR PHYSICAL FITNESS MEANS NOTHING IF YOUR COUNTRY IS DESTROYED AND THE CONSTITUTION IS "TREADED UPON"! If fitness is your only concept of individual responsiblity and hard work - then you are a shallow human being! GO Libertarian Party and Ron Paul!

It doesn’t matter; man is his own worst enemy, he will destroy himself.

cfogc (#15) I really hope you did start something, because we need it. The goal is for ideas like yours to spark interest in likeminded people, people with concern for national and international security, and then for these people to find each other, creating the Insurgent Consciousness necessary to deal with today’s challenges, from drug cartels to insurgencies.

why do i think crossfit is stupid? because its generalized to everyone... anyone that has read literature on strength training... and no not in muscle and fitness... knows that kids need to be trained differently than adults... just like men and women need to be trained differently... there are major physiological factors that influence this... its silly to ignore it... feel free to tell me that crossfit is the most amazing thing since sliced bread but i'm not buying it and i'm gonna laugh when it becomes a way of the past for the next trendy exercise gimmick...

moma,
do you feel better now??? take your lame ass somewhere else then... that way you can become part of the past!

Cfogc: your piece on access information superiority is absolutely correct, and is a large part of the problem our military is currently experiencing. I've heard the golden ratio for anti-insurgency campaigns being something like 10:1; that is, for every dollar (or unit of effort) the insurgents spend, we'll have to put in ten just to match them, and information is a huge part of that.

Re: fair tax, as mentioned above: no. I'm sorry, but it's horribly regressive, even with the poverty line credits and whatnot.
"H.R. 25, the FairTax bill, while it still takes a lot of money away from the Americans, it does so in a fair way: you only pay taxes when you by (sic) new goods and services."
If the FairTax is revenue neutral, some groups will pay less in taxes than they do now, some more. Who will pay more?

Sorry Conner, I forgot that you turned 17. I also forgot to add what a genuinely nice young man he is and an exceptional role model for everyone at Brand X and the Crossfit community at large.

The way I look at it is, The first thing I do every mourning when I wake up is upload my pc to check out this intense FREE workout. This FREE work out is provided by people I have never met in my life. If Coach and Lauren want to post a political article on a FREE-FREE day, I FREELY read it. I enjoy them, yet I also get to FREELY make up my mind on my own. If you’re using Crossfit as your only source of political news, views and/or enlightenment, you’re missing the point. Thanks Coach and Lauren for this FREE site.

On a lighter note…

Did anyone else happen to catch Rippetoe’s quote below all the entire political garb. “I have been accused of being an asshole on more than one occasion. This is probably due to the fact that I am an asshole…” That made me giggle like a school girl. Pricless, simlpy priceless.

It's always funny to see people get in a huff about politics. Do you not realize that all politicians are crooks and liars? Life is too short to worry about that shite. Go out, train hard, and most of all, have fun.

Life may be too short for me, But my daughter is going to grow up at some point, and inherit 40 Trillion dollars in unfunded-liabilities that our government has run up in social security and medicare costs... (see heritage foundation)

ponder this:

widespread "voter suppression" in 2000 and 2004

not an instance of "voter suppression" in 2008

what happened?

I wonder if we're all over-thinking this and missing an obvious point.

Has anyone noticed a trend in the photos of CrossFitters? Look at the occupations of these folks...

Military, Special Operators, Law Enforcement, First Responders, Pro Atheltes

Where do you think most of these folks fall on the political spectrum? These people are doers, not talkers. They have a certain worldview, just like folks at PBS have a certain worldview.

Observation 1: Folks on the left want the government to do something. Folks on the right - do something.

Observation 2: The top 1% of taxpayers already pay more than the entire bottom 90%.

Observation 3: Lax regulation would be irrelevant if the government hadn't forced banks to make loans to people who couldn't afford them, in order to be "fair".

Question: When it comes to actually doing something with their own time and money, which political philosophy "cares" more?

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MWJjZWVkY2YyM2I2NGNmZTFlNGNmNjcxMzI0MzQyYjM=

Heres a random thought... I never really realized how good our camo is until I saw today's photo. The pants blend into the ground almost perfectly. It almost looks like they don't have lower torsos in some of those pictures.

On the politically thing... There is nothing libertarian about not believing every credible scientist alive when they say that humans are having a negative effect on the planet. In fact, as someone who tends to lean in the libertarian direction on most issues, I never would have considering the opinions put forth by this website as belonging to that political ideology. In fact most of the controversial posts are just weird, random opinions (global warming is fake, don't believe the polls when they say Obama is going to win the election, international cooperation is anti-american, etc.)

#57 Moma

If you are so anti-crossfit, then why the hell are you even looking at this website, let alone posting??
Kids are trained differently than adults here, hence the whole CrossFitkids website and WODs. Do some research before making blanket generalizations about things you don't understand. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not every opinion is correct.
Hard work is not a gimmick. You get out what you put in. Some people are lazy and weak willed and will not make gains on any program. Look deep inside and check your heart.
Perhaps you could enlighten us all with the "correct" way to workout and give some evidence. People here (unlike in many fitness communities) welcome the truth.

To everyone that is worried about throwing the hate around.
I believe that criticism of feats is great we can improve on anything we do and if everyone thought that every feat was perfect hey welcome to the real world it not going to happen. But take in the criticism and improve on yourself. I am sure that Jason Fran will be different next time he does it because of the criticism. I Belive the quote "Men will die for points" is why we use a white board it is us as a group criticising each and everyday. I'm firefighter and we verbalably asswhoop each other for just about anything. I'm sure this is the same in military and police dept. also. I believe that crossfitters are the same close knit group and we need to get and give verbal asswhooping daily it is about the comp. of it all. But if you are not in our group hell have no fury we will blindly diffend each other. Look at what was happening a few months ago with someone bad mouthing us as agroup we stood together. I recently had a doctor that does our annual physicals state that Crossfit wasn't enough cardio work and should be down played and everyone needs to get on the treadmill and elliptical machines. I wasn't in a postion have a discussion about crossfit but did ask the doctor to join me in a wod(he hasn't taken me up on the offer. What doesn't kill us only make us stronger.
Kevin Straub

You know what I hate about political discussions?
Labels! A person's way of thinking about politics is unique to them, and labeling something as "liberal" "conservative" is a cheap way to try to discount and disregard whatever that person is saying.

I think these labels are stupid and divisive. I think they are much like ethnic slurs, intended to keep people separate and in hate.

To paraphrase a famous comedian--No thinking person is either liberal or conservative on all topics.

More importantly, I believe we should strive to discuss politics in a personally detached way, myself included. I think that this would greatly enhance our communication and allow for progress. But I don't think that the idea of becoming detached from your ideas is anything new, spiritual leaders have been saying it for thousands of years.

The mind is a trickster, always changing, always bringing in new thoughts and ideas, usually false perceptions based on our past experiences, which were also false perceptions. The nature of the mind is to make you believe that these thoughts are your own, that you are your mind. I do this too. But it is a basic fallacy of humanity.

Thoughts are impersonal phenomena sprung from biologic machinery and input from the external world. Detaching from the idea that thoughts are "ours" would change the world. But, others have already said this, better than I ever could.

All beings strive to be happy. Attachment to our thoughts keeps us in bondage to a sense organ that will enslave us as long as we continue to believe that we are what we think. These attachments are responsible for some of the largest portions of human suffering.

"Don't believe everything you think"

Awesome work lad! That is some serious work. This next comment is not about Connor, but an aspect of Fran. Get rid of the damn ball!!!!!!! I don't get it. It only decreases ROM and many people "bounce" of it. If a beginner needs help with percieving depth and the ball helps, great, but that person would have no business attempting Fran. What is it with the ball?

ok, I usually just post my results each day and let everyone else destroy each other over silly sometimes ridiculous comments about how who is better than who, what workout routine works..blah blah blah..

I graduated with an exercise Science Degree in 2002, and have been working in the fitness area for the last 6 consecutive years. I have tried probably dozens of workout routines that have shown results, and sometimes great results.

Since going to a cert this past sept. and doing solely crossfit workouts the last 9 weeks I have fould that my chronic back problems have ceased, my body fat% has dropped from 16% to 11% and my body weight has dropped from 190 to 180 thanks to the "zone" and Crossfit.

Anyway my point is is that Crossfit works for me and my clients, it has shown the quickest results and has fueled me to be the best I can be. Thank you Crossfit for changing my life and allowing us to compete against each other just by reading this comment section. Workout whatever way you want to, I'm doing Crossfit!!

The modern Republican party has given up the meaning of conservatism, and oriented toward a religious minority that is currently fashionable.

What most now think of as "Christian conservatives" are neither Christian nor conservative. Christ said the rich should give away their possessions. Turn the other cheek. Take into your home those who need shelter, clothes, food, water. Don't start a revolution against the dictator. For god's sake, America wouldn't exist today if we had followed all that. Europe would be under the Nazis or Russians. Biblical family values? Through most of the bible marriage was ideally between one man and several women (or slaves). Premarital sex was ok for men, but got the death penalty for women. That part of the Koran that says women should keep their hair covered? Well the Bible says the same thing. This does not reflect American values, so stop claiming that it does.

I am conservative. I think we should conserve the environment. I think we should keep taxes high enough and spending (Iraq anyone?) low enough to keep our grandchildren's nation out of crushing debt to China. We should keep the government out of regulating who can get married and what recreational drugs we can use and what a woman (or man) does with their bodies.. As government has always been the biggest threat to religious freedom, we should conserve the highest possible separation between church and state.

America was built on immigration. We are nowhere near close to overpopulation. Lincoln gave away vast chunks of heartland to thousands of immigrants willing to settle down and work hard. He started universities to train these new Americans. He connected the east and west with the first railroad. For the love of god, why do people think it's a good idea to keep immigrants out now? We should be encouraging the best and brightest and hardest working from all over the world to join us. That's a big reason we got this far, why should we start coasting now?

The authority to tax incomes was not really granted by the Constitution. But we've been living with it for quite a long time. Since the beginning, rich people have paid more taxes. Poor people pay less, but get the same benefits. That's what "spreading the wealth" means. The idea that the percent or two of difference between McCain and Obama makes one "socialist" and one "conservative" is ridiculous.

Finally, as a military officer, my oath and loyalty is to the Constitution, not the President. Why do you think that might be?

the Washington Post admitted to leaning to the left during the Obama campaign, I wonder if the rest of the mainstream media will ever admit the same?

I like beer and xfit. I'll leave the politics, ripping on people and overall hatred to the rest of you. I’m going to enjoy life and not take anything to seriously.

Y'all some wordy folks. I'mma go visit a farm and get my hands in the dirt. Type away Typie Typington.

M/36/180lbs.

After wtaching Connor do Fran I was inspired to try my first attempt at it. I've seen so many Fran videos and times people made it look easy.

My first Fran: 4:19

Connor that was a great time and an inspirational video. Keep up the great work.

Meh, I don't think the Politics of CrossFit articles are worth much. One take on it is that the obvious Right leanings of CrossFit are more a business move than anything else, an inroad into the military market for example. For reasons I will never understand, the bulk of military personnel appear to be more Republican leaning than anything else, so I can understand the need to kiss ass a bit if that will help expand the business of CrossFit.

On the other hand, there's no way to prove that the conservative slant isn't genuine and just happens to mesh well with the views of many in the military/first responder communities. I personally feel it is likely a mix of both, but no one knows without the subject being directly addressed.

At the end of the day, CrossFit is about better one's life and no one with the label of Republican/Democrat/Conservative/Liberal can argue that it's a bad thing to enhance quality of life.

#72 - Ryan F., re: media bias

A factual correction. The Washington Post has NOT "admitted" it leaned to the left or favored Obama during the election campaign.

The Post employs an ombudsman, who is paid to express her opinions about coverage. She expressed the opinion that the paper had tilted to Obama. The paper admitted nothing. And for good reason. The ombudsman's opinion was ill-founded and has been very effectively refuted.

The larger issue is whether the mainstream media was "in the tank " for Obama. Despite what you may have read or heard, that charge has yet to be substantiated. All that has been shown so far is that the media is hung up on horse race coverage and accurately reported Obama's lead. Larger studies may show bias. But it hasn't happened yet.

For more details, see this article in Editor and Publisher magazine (W/F/S):
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/columns/pressingissues_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003889222

On the other side of the coin, the left criticized the Washington Post for uncritically passing along many of McCain's unfounded charges without pointing out their falsity. And don't forget it was The New York Times that revived the dormant Bill Ayers issue by publishing a prominent re-hash late in the campaign.

I feel the need to point something out here: The political party that identifies itself as "liberal" is decidedly not. The term liberal is rooted in the word liberty aka freedom. There is nothing liberal about the vast centralization of power being pushed by both of the dominant political parties in this country and the overwhelming nanny state it is creating. There is nothing free about a government that forces you to do anything besides to not physically harm other free citizens. You can fill the Congress, the senate, and the White House with as many democrats (or republicans for that matter) as you want, and it still won't be "liberal."

The United States has been a world leader for as long as it has existed. Why are we now becoming followers? And not only that, but the path we are following, the path being paved by Western Europe, is the path that F.A. Hayek so presciently dubbed "The Road to Serfdom."

Jon W 71

One thing I like about listening to intelligent libertarians is that they have the capacity to articulate positions on a wide range of issues that are consistent with one another. I think that when libertarianism is pushed and stressed, its internal consistency reveals itself to be a rhetorical virtue. This is because the consistency and politcal/moral coherence that a libertarian view imposes on the world does not accurately describe the teeming, inchoate and evanescent character of political and moral relationships as they actually take place over time, i.e, in history (or even in autobiography). Nonetheless, the coherence in libertarianism goes deep enough that when articulate libertarians join in a debate, they often inject a frankness, elegance and economy of political discourse that recent Republican religio-military-imperial "conservatism" has been utterly incapable of doing (youtube Ron Paul in the Republican primary debates to get a sense of this).

Bingo 25

Lincoln long ago became a shared symbol of leadership in crisis (Gettysburg Address). His beliefs and policies beyond those reflected in the Emancipation Proclamation will become evermore removed from the world's collective memory. Obama wants to lead, and to go down in history as a great man - Lincoln is both far enough away in time, and close enough in collective consciousness to act as a symbol of shared greatness and unity.

Amazing work! Way to go Connor!

Comment #57 - Posted by: moma

Many myths about training kids, are myths. If you disapprove of something, please post the reasons why and if you want a discussion post an alternate theory. I think it would be an interesting discussion.

She said "YES"!

http://gsxcrossfit.blogspot.com/

BEAST! if hes 16 how come hes not doing real crossfit? im 14 and i do real crossfit i have to scale for weights though. i use 55 for fran. i tried 65 but i failed

as a foreigner, the most glaringly obvious difference between my country's citizens' views of politics and how they apply to them individually, and your own in the USA, appears to be the polarization approach.

It's all or or nothing for one camp or the other with you guys.

If youidentify with being a democrat then it has to be a case of swallowing the whole hook line and sinker plus the rod and waders too, or you're a fascist in disguise

If you identify with being a republican, then by god you'd better go all the way with those viewpoints and policies for fear of being outed as a socialist

Dunno if this is a result of the aggressive marketing required to 'sell' each political standpoint to a potentially non-voting populace- but this 'either you're with us or you're against us' view is perhaps the least mature and potentially dangerous aspect of your system, from the perspective of the rest of the world

In my country our system is not exactly top-notch, but there is a recognition that politicians are a breed apart and do things a particular way and say things in a way that bolsters their chances of election, re-election, or personal financial gain. And when election time comes, there is none of your chest-beating and flag waving but a careful weighing up of which party's policies will best support ME and MINE for the next 4 years

And if thats the right then great, and if it's the left then great too

We all understand here in Australia that there is a big disconnect between policy spouted out for political purposes and what goes on after the election, and armed with this healthy cynicism, choices are made

But then voting is compulsory here and i think you guys would adopt a similar arm's-length individual involvement in your own political system if you had no choice, in real terms, of who you vote for

All i see, and i'm sure a lot of the world shares this, is the awesome power of the US political lobby/ spin /marketing machine in action when it's election time over thhere, and it's scary poarizing effect on your populace

Has anyone ordered a shirt from operation phoenix to help raise money for the marines? I ordered mine over a week ago and it took them a week to send me an email saying that it will be up to two weeks before i could get my shirt, so that means three weeks. I was just wondering if anyone else is having to wait that long? I'm not complaining; i'm happy to support such a great program but i was a little curious if anyone had some info on it.

I had a post that disappeared when some Google toolbar popped up that I apparently forgot to opt out of. Mod's, I don't normally ask for assistance, but if that one made it to the filter, if you could get that one out, I'd appreciate it. If it's just gone, so be it.

With respect to the polarization issue--which is very relevant--let me share a simple anecdote. Everyone in my nuclear family is very liberal. The last time we got together, of course we talked politics. I shared my views, and promptly got accused of spending too much time with "right wingers". We had to abandon the discussion of Iraq, because I was a "true believer", with whom there was no point in talking. The final straw, though, that made me genuinely angry, was when they disagreed with my own self assessment of being a moderate. In my own view, I AM a moderate. I told them I didn't hate Clinton, and saw many positives in him, although I think much of the good he did was because a Republican Congress held his feet to the fire for 6 years.

However, all of the awful, hateful, vicious things that people say about Bush make me mad. I didn't support the "Get Clinton" campaign, and I don't support the "Get Bush" campaign. So when my father started comparing Bush to Hitler, we wound up parting on very unfavorable terms.

I read "Rise and Fall of the Third Reich". I have his biography on my shelf, which I will read when I get to it. I understand the history. And the words that the Left uses with respect to Bush, the attitudes of mockery and condescension they bring to the table, and overall the consistent failure on the part of all but a few to engage substantively with the issues just infuriates me.

And one can trace all of these themes, and tactics directly back to Lenin himself. Does that mean everyone who uses them is a Communist? Of course not. In fact, given the sad state of our educational system, most of the folks out there under 35 would probably have to Google just who he was.

But when you read what Saul Alinsky taught throughout his career, it can be summarized as "set the terms of the debate so low that no dignified, self respecting person would want to participate. Then use their absence to consolidate and expand your base."

And this has been done. This isn't the only place I go. Insult, the desire to inflict injury, frivolity, determined ignorance: these are the order of the day in our public sphere.

CrossFit is the only place I know of that even approaches the sorts of dialogues our Founding Fathers intended in enshring the Freedom of Speech in our Bill of Rights.

No doubt I'll have more to say later, but I have to go work out.

The people who are NOT moderate are the ones who accuse everyone who is not on b

M/42/145

Have a question off the subject. first I have to say I love crossfit and am devoted to it. I am a bit remiss though to see the word "infidel" on the crossfit shirts. The word mean one who has no faith or doesn't believe in God. Now I do and have no problem w/ those who don't, it is a personal choice, but I really like the color of that shirt. What do yall think

48/6'/182

Cindy

19 rounds + 5/10/10

DOne at CF Tribe in NJ

Jon W #71
Well said sir, thank you!

Billy #73 and Dan Martin #74
Even better.

I've gone from sickness to wellness, so I'll take my free workouts, free massive library of demos, and free diet advice and continue to work towards fitness with my mouth shut...well mostly shut.

I also agree with Scott #76. At least I hope it's that and not aligning with religous wingnuts. But really I could care less as long as the free workouts keep coming.

Do you think you could convince 12 of your close friends to give up their lifes for something they knew was not true?

I don't think I could.

I don't think Jesus Christ did either.

#31 & #50

somewhat ironic that you are in favor of invading foreign countries to supposedly re-instate individual freedoms while denying your fellow americans their own civil rights.

Were you not so blinded by the ignorance and bigotry of the God-fearing religious right, you would see that we are already in Hell.

Long time since posting here but still CFing since '03...

Loud kudos to Connor on (another) amazing achievement!
I've had the privilege of seeing Connor progress in his fitness for the past 5 years. I've seen CF (and I mean CF administered by his father in a very focused, movement oriented regime; leaving times and weight as secondary goals... the precursor to what is now formally CFKids) take Connor from a gifted bodyweight exercise machine (push-ups, sit-ups, squats) to someone that can accomplish a 2:30 Fran as Rx'd, 15 muscle-ups in <1:30, and 29 135# OHS in 1:30. I've also seen what happens to him after he's spent time away from BrandX training, opting to train with a school sports team under more "mainstream", "traditional" methods - kinda depressing...
In the end many of us decide to stick with CF because at the end of the day it just works - the proof is in the output from the black box. Similarly, CFKids is showing the same results in improving the fitness levels of the kids I see at BrandX classes; and the best part is how much Big Fun they are having while doing it! Amazing stuff!

I think that Barry raises a good question: how do we define "moderate"? It seems that many people want to define themselves as moderate, but do we have a consistent definition? Is it simply finding the middle ground between the two major party positions, or is it understanding and adopting viewpoints based upon broad facts particular to the matter at hand?

You are amazing Connor! Congratulations on a fantastic effort.

I recognize those sea containers...

Killer video.

Yesterday's "flying pullups" video made me think of something that I used to try when I was a kid. I had to go and try it and got it on film. I call them "mini flying pullups" although you're not really pulling up as much as pulling across.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZLXCuiCINY

33 yom 220 bwt

agility ladder 30 minutes

tabata pull-ups,push-ups,abmat unanchored situps, and squats to dynamax ball

#85 wrote

"CrossFit is the only place I know of that even approaches the sorts of dialogues our Founding Fathers intended in enshring the Freedom of Speech in our Bill of Rights."

Wow. Just wow.

Justin

I've been going through the videos like the junkie I am and am now curious to know if anybody has the info to where the mashup songs are coming from. Does anybody out there have a link to where they're coming from?

I don't think of the political posts as "libertarian" as the article implies. Libertarians are the ultimate liberals. No government is a good government. No taxes. No protectionism. Free trade rules. Etc. Sounds good, right? Who likes paying taxes?

Yet, libertarians would argue that collecting taxes to pay for a military is bad. I don't think this really accords with the majority of us cross fitters, who I'd argue are "pro taxes for the military".

To sum up, to call the cross-fit political posts "libertarian" is incorrect, in my mind. I think "Militarily liberal" might be a better fit.

#89 EJ

No one thinks the disciples believed in something that they thought wasn't true. People believe a lot of things are true that are not true.

http://www.newsadvance.com/lna/news/local/article/30_years_later_the_legacy_of_jonestown/10641/

M/48/153/1-1-06

Squats from ystd, top 185 x 5 PR.

Then "Christine", 3 rounds for time:
Row 500M
BW DL 12 Reps
20" Box Jump 21 Reps

As Rx'd 14:05 PR (Prev. > 17:00)

Re: CF
My attorney was in the gym. We hadn't laid eyes on each other in 8 months or so. He commented on how lean I looked. At the same moment one of his colleagues walked by and called me the strongest man in the gym over 45yo.

This stuff works. Can you even imagine what Connor, Kalista, and the other youngsters will be like in, say, 10 years? Whoa...

Connor - I was jumping up and down when I watched that video! My only regret is that I was not there to congratulate you in person!!!
Rx'd Fran in 2:30 is absolutely incredible. But Rx'd Fran in 2:30 at the mere age of 16? AMAZING. Your hard work and determination are so admirable.
You, Mariah, Kallista, Keegan and all the other youngen's out there are an encouragement for us all!!

Meant to say 17 - I, apparently, am out of the loop. ; )

Justin,

"Wow. Just wow" does, as you seem to imply, falsify that comment. I was speaking generally, and the intent was to lay out my own ideal of principled people speaking frankly and directly, and all of one mind with respect to the necessity of solving a problem, and merely differing as to the means.

Obviously, we could do much better, but the bar is set so low it would be easier to step on it than trip over it. Many places, it is absent entirely. There is no point other than amusement, and no system other than mockery and cut and paste dumps.

We see someone (#90), for example, comparing the "Religious right" to Stalinist Iraq. In the first case, they object when schools are told by a national court to take "under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance. In the other, people who didn't agree fast enough with Saddam Hussein, or in a way he liked, got hacked into pieces, and put in burlap bags and dumped on their families porches (this happened to an Army officer who was dumb enough to suggest Saddam's generalship in the Iran-Iraq War was other than perfect).

Do you see the problem? This is imbecility. This is utter, complete cessation of rational, fact based thinking. It is an error of magnitude so enormous that one can only conclude this person has lost their capacity--through lack of use--for coherent thinking in any form.

What can any of us do in the face of such concentrated ignorant hatred? Respond in kind?

To maintain my sanity, sometimes I do. I'll admit it. I came up with the term "leftist rednecks" this morning. I like it.

Does that add anything? Not really. It's just something that's amusing.

More generally, though, the point is the hatred on the part of the left. Rush is tacky. Saul Alinsky was vicious. He said you should fight so dirty that you should apologize if you ever accidentally hit ABOVE the belt.

And I see it. Leftists have called for a War Crimes Tribunal for every President since Wilson. Every President we elected in the 20th Century was , according to them, evil.

(Alinsky, of course, hit his heyday in the 60's and early 70's, but he was a Marxist, and he was just better at teaching Leninism than most.)

And you see it in moral relativism. Alinsky said that you should hang people by their own standards. No one is perfect. No one can live up to their standards. That means you can cry foul constantly, even if the proposed solution, while imperfect, is the best available, as in Iraq.

Moreover, it keeps the attention focussed on your enemy, which means the much, much larger crimes of the regimes and nations you want to copy go unnoticed.

For example, we are told we live in "hell" now. Did you know that the Saudis have religious police that can go into anyone's home they suspect of any form of immorality, and arrest them? If you are committing infidelity, or homosexual acts, or even drinking alcohol?

And that some of these acts, like homosexuality, are potentially punishable by death?

I've been in mourning for two weeks. It will end. It always does. You work through it, and emerge stronger and wiser. But I won't shorten it, or deny myself this process.

Perhaps selfishly, I do--my own recent claim to the contrary notwithstanding--sometimes use this site to work through things. I'll apologize for that, and hope for the continued indulgence of those who run it. I do appreciate the forum that has been created here a great deal, and of course the people, who make such a great place.

Coach,

I have been an avid Crossfitter since reading about it in a Chicago Tribune article and checking out Crossfit Milwaukee about a year and a half ago. Needless to say I was instantly hooked. I had always considered myself to be in good shape but after several years of plateauing on a normal lifting & running/cardio regimen I began to lose motivation. Crossfit gave me all the drive I had before and more. The results I have seen and the continued excitement/anticipation of seeing what rigors await me each day have brought new life to the idea of what physical fitness truly means to me. In that spirit thanks for all you do:

"Great leaders inspire greatness in others."

5 Rounds of:
15 pace 75# Dumbbell carry
15 reps PVC pushups
15 pace 75# Dumbbell carry
15 reps 65# Floorwipers

18:53

cool rest day!

done fran as rx'd in 6min52 (new PR)

than ran 25 min on treadmill

I'd love to see a video titled 'Strict Fran'- we've seen every other version of it!

38/M/180/6'

Make-up wod

Row 1000m 3:40
25 pullups
50 DL 135lb
50 Pushups
50 Boxjumps 20"
50 KTE
50 KB swings 55lb
25 pullups
Row 1000m 4:16
total: 24:15

Politics from "Down South"

I'll keep MY Freedom, My Faith, My Guns, and MY Money......

Yall can keep the "Change"!!!

thank you for nobody responding to my "infidel" question- touchy subject.

EJ
#89
i agree
(READ) evidence that demands a verdict
to compare the 12 followers of the Christ to Jonestown folk is ridiculous
i love crossfit
it is thru crossfit that i am reaching the lost

Comment #110 - Posted by: mitch

I think infidel, in the context of the shirt, means one who does not accept the bodybuilding religion that dominates weight rooms.

Although, since I'm an atheist, it works both ways for me. Looks like I need to buy that shirt.

Connor has been CrossFitting since he was 12, and yes that is Fran as Rx’d with 95#’s. Mikki and Cyndi were on CrossFit radio recently (http://radio.crossfit.com ) and discussed how CrossFit Kids is not simply scaled down CrossFit. It is absolutely and entirely CrossFit, geared and designed for a special population and the developmental needs of that population. We spend a great deal of time on this at the kids cert as well as how to effectively teach kids.

Recently we attended a school district meeting where we were told that 75% of the kids attending our local schools failed to meet the minimum PE standards of our state. Our CrossFit Kids not only pass with flying colors but they set the school records. More than one of our kids have come to class after PE testing with stories of being told to stop doing pull up or sit ups because “They were taking to much time”. One boy volunteered to go first on the pull ups during testing. The rest of the boys in the class chose to do the “Flexed Arm Hang” in an effort not to be compared with to the CrossFit Kid.

The standard strength and conditioning programs and PE programs in the schools have been a dismal failure. Kids are overweight, and unfit. CrossFit Kids is changing that. We have 8 year olds who can talk to you about diet. Kids who will tell you, not just that sugar is bad for you, but why it’s bad for you. More importantly the kids love the program. When you call a CrossFit Kids Class at our place you need to get out of the way. You’ll get trampled. Young kids love the classes, the teens hang out challenge each other to contests etc. It’s fun, and it works. Because they love it and its fun, they’ll continue to do it.

It is quite likely that Connor will not be appearing in many more CrossFit Kids videos, that is unless he goes sub 2:00 on Fran before he is 18.

I'm just waiting (with breathe abated) for tomorrow's WOD......
GO 'SKINS!!!

I don't get to say this much so here it goes:

Rx'd

hehe

to all you Obama fans.... i pray for you! wake up and realize what you have done. as for all you people that question any legitmate fran time or helen time,.... etc... piss off!

#65 -Mark in Austin...

...wonders where those in the military and law enforcement fall in the political spectrum.

The answer may be: not as far to the right as many people suppose.

Military members are still more conservative and more Republican than the population as a whole.

But an analysis of voting patterns suggests GOP support among the military may be declining.

See (w/f/s):
http://www.pollster.com/blogs/holm_military_partisanship_ove.php

Mrs. Bingo and I just watched Sen. and Mrs. Obama on 60 Minutes.

Regardless of whom I may have cast my vote, Mr. Obama is soon to be my President. His interview went well. He did well.

I am hopeful. We live in America. We ALL should be hopeful. God bless America. God bless the President-elect.

And God bless the President.

@112 -Dave

Evidence that demands a verdict is just mental gymnastics for the already true believer. It is not really about scholarship, or evidential reasoning.

The problem with these books about trying to show that Jesus is divine or rose from the dead are that a 100% rational person has to reject them from the very first page.

This is because coming back from the dead is physically impossible. This means that any other explanation, no matter how far-fetched is more likely (even though real scholarly explanations are very far from far fetched and actually make more sense than the beliefs of the true believer).

Think about it, if we are judging the most likely explanation ANYTHING is more likely than someone coming back from the dead. To believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ requires faith, not logic or reason. Our logic and reason lead us away from the supernatural, by definition.

The best reason to believe in Jesus is because you get something out of it. If you do, more power to you. Believe what you want to believe, but don't pretend that it is logical, or reasonable, or supported by historical scholarship.

thanks George

good retort, maybe I'll buy the shirt also,but I still believe in God....3-2-1-Go....Boyah

al b #101,
You are mistakenly (understandably so), equating libertarians and anarcho-capitalists. The libertarians actually believe that the only true function of government is to maintain a military to only be used in response or reaction to protect the freedom of its citizens. This military, as it benefits citizens, is of course paid for through taxation. That taxation is at a FLAT RATE (anything else is economic discrimination).
The anarcho-capitalists believe (quite rationally) that if all production is through private ownership of the means of production, human beings will become so necessarily intertwined that any physical aggression against another party will become self defeating and the aggressors will be weeded out by market forces and cease to exist.
At the point when all countries of Earth become truly free, these two ethos become equivalent, the only reason libertarians require the military is to protect them from the "ists"- fascists, communists, socialists, populists, and any other "ist" who would enslave his fellow man to reach his own ends.

#112 dave

Why is it ridiculous? Is it because you share their views?

I've checked the blog, and I see that many of you have looked at it out since cfogc (#15) put his article up and "started something." Judging by the level of discussion I have always seen on crossfit, I would like to encourage anyone who wants to comment on Insurgent Consciousness to go ahead. cfogc and I would love to hear from you.

Rest day: Run 50 minutes
51:15 / 5.7 miles (~9:00/mile)

Sorry, I didn't provide a clear link. The blog I was referring to is insurgentconsciousness.typepad.com.

So far all of the contributers are crossfiters.

Does anyone know where to get that timer in the video?

Dammit, all of you have completely missed the point of today's rest day commments. It is NEVER ok to eat bananas!

Libertarian doesn't necessarily mean "right". Hitler was on the right, but he was an authoritarian, which is the opposite of a libertarian.

The Dalai Lama is more libertarian than autoritarian, yet he is also more "left" than "right".

Barry,

As our Crossfit Buffon, I'm hoping you can provide us with a short Encyclopedie entry on these "leftist rednecks" you've recently identified (I imagine they germinate in liberal arts colleges, labour unions, Criminal-Defence Lawyer's Associations, and occasionally they can be found mating among the tall weeds of the Federal Treasury and the larger financial institutions) In the great chain of being they likely fit below the white-haired yokel-welfairist, but just above the spectacled pseudo-intellectual bumpkin-collectivist.

David 122

You didn't explicitly state that you identify yourself as some sort of "libertarian", but I'd be interested in reading your answer to the following questions: (a) are there any historical examples you can think of that would support the idea that a libertarian society would be less prone to devolve into one of the "isms" you mention (or some variants of them) than the mixed-economy welfare state that has been the United States for nearly a century? (b) are political and social not just as likely to occur within a generation of the "establishment" of the libertarian (dare I say) utopia you imagine, as they occur presently? And while you're looking for historical examples please keep in mind that to be relevant to us now, they should provide a model that might apply to polities that are larger (in the case of the US) by several hundreds of millions of times than the city-states, principalities or commonwealths that have made up much of the last 2500 years of human history.

Did Friday's workout of Power Snap and 400- 5 rounds, and made a working structure fire @ work a couple hours later. First in!

Talk about a workout!
Houston Station 55 get'n some on this cold night!

My problem with the rest articles is that they give rise to the basest internet conversations and remind me that people get behind political and social positions for stupid reasons (most often laziness) and defend their ideas sloppily at best. It's particularly disappointing in a group that has a very smart and rational approach to fitness that's based on the very best reasoning in the field.

122 David:

Interesting point... I've never heard of the term anarcho-capitalist before. As you note: "the military, as it benefits its citizens, will be paid for by taxation." I'd say there are lots of things, other than the military, that benefit the people and really need to be paid for through taxation (e.g., parks). As such, it seems pretty fishy to me to say the military is okay but not other public goods, in the context of "libertarianism". Nonetheless, I think we could still come up with a new -ism to include the military but exclude other public goods.

I too like the FLAT TAX, but for different reasons. (I don't necessarily agree with your "economic discrimination" comment because it's loaded with way too much value judgment for my liking.) Personally, I like flat taxes for the simple reason that it makes taxes way easier to pay. Moreover, with a big enough standard deduction, people at the low end still don't pay too much in the way of taxes.

All in all, I appreciated your intelligent response and I'm going to think about your ideas some more. Good debating, sir.

To #113
I think we should put out CrossFit "atheist" shirts too in addition to the "infidel" shirts!

Nice job Connor!

Matt

It´s fun to read rightist views. They ACTUALLY think (and speak it out loud on occasion!) that rightwing politics will HELP people with minimum wages-jobs.

I have had a smile on my lips for weeks now. Go, Obama, go.

(Staggered one week behind)

Last Sunday's WOD:

Power clean 1-1-1-1-1-1-1 reps:
135, 185, 205, 215, 215, 205, 185
(Bad form/ failed a couple of times on the 215, but tried again and got it right).

Before the WOD, started off with deadlift max - 455 lbs (sequence: 135 lb warm-up, 225, 315, 405, 505 fail, 455). First time maxing on deadlift.

#135 McCain

As a conservative living in SC for 34 of 38n yr, with the exception of 4 yr for training in VA, I presume my views are the ones you imply. I am with Bingo, I pray for this country and our Pres-elect, not because I agree with anything he proposes but b/c I love America and want her to be "righted" on her course. Its too bad that those in the "less than conservative" camps cannot have the same mindset when "we" are in "power".

Having said that, I really only have one close acquaintaince who actually admits voting for Obama/Biden. I realize that my circle and much of SC is extremely conservative. However, I have NEVER seen the conservative base (note I am not talking Republican here) so energized. We realize we only had something to vote "against" this time, and admit the GOP really dropped the ball for conservatism.

I will ask you to keep in mind that in spite of tremendous economic turmoil 57 million people still voted against Obama, and as many as 20% of true conservative "sat on their hands". Trust me friend, we lost this battle but our "troops" are rallying and we will fight until the end of this "war".

The things I mentioned earlier in my post; Freedom, Faith, Gun Rights, and Taxation have been fought for figuratively and literally by generations of Americans, and we "aint gonna stop now". Not to mention all the other social issues on the table, Rights of the unborn, the definition of marriage, Prayer in School, Christian references in Public domains, etc, etc.
My point, which has now gone longer than planned; don't get too comfortable with that smile on your face, as someone more tenacious than me once said, "We haven't even begun to fight!!" :-)

#120: "This is because coming back from the dead is physically impossible." This is your belief, not a fact. You have taken materialism as a bedrock belief, yet none of the best physicists in the world believe they can say with certainty if matter--or anything--exists, absent an Observer.

http://quantumtantra.blogspot.com/2008/08/steven-hawking-joke.html

Prole,

What is the claim made of reflexive supporters of the status quo, who favor "unprogressive" ideas like uncritical religiosity, the importance of gun ownership, and the necessity of staying close to people who are similar to you? Rednecks.

A leftist redneck is someone who is the same structurally in every respect except the specific content of their reflexive beliefs. Leftist rednecks believe in welfare for the poor, whether it works or not. They believe in Affirmative Action, whether it works or not. They believe in banning guns, whether it works or not.

Tribally, they accept anyone who is willing to accept their foundational idea that all identities and cultural ideosyncrasies are negotiable, and are ultimately to be eliminated in the Great Coming Together, which will bring about global peace and harmony, in a world which is peaceful since nobody believes anything, except that beliefs are good, provided they are held by someone else. Once they eliminate everyone else, presumably its just a giant rave 24/7--with better drugs, of course--like they had in the Matrix.

Those are leftist rednecks, whose intolerance is hidden to them by their internal conformity, and inability to grasp that people different from them have the right to voice their opinions without being verbally assaulted.

One other thing: the connection of horror movies, moral assaults on our common culture, and Leftism.

People fail to grasp--many of them because they are superficial, some of them because they have already been bitten by the bug--the tremendous damage being done, in my view, to our nation by movies like Hostel, the Saw series, Halloween, and Wolf Creek.

The point is not that people immediately go out and imitate these things, as the jackals who defend this filth sometimes want to claim those who object to these films are arguing.

No, the point is that much of the deepest happiness in this world comes from the tender sentiments, and those require faith and emotional openness. These films, which are intended for juveniles, and are consumed by them over and over, teach the precise opposite of empathy and openness. Movies like Scream (which I haven't seen, but which I understand contains graphic violence and flippant humor) teach children to laugh at others suffering.

Exposed over and over to scenes which would cause pain in any psychologically normal person--of graphic torture, and immense physical and emotional suffering--they lose touch with some part of themselves which would allow them--historically did allow them--to love in non-ironic ways.

When I say non-ironic, let me offer a thought. 100 years ago people had sweethearts. Listening to old music, people were much more innocent. Boys courted girls. They bought them flowers, and showered affection on them. No doubt there were premarital "encounters" then as now, but it wasn't the norm. Respectable girls didn't do that, and respectable boys didn't want girls who did.

Nowadays, it seems to me, our young people don't have first loves so much as first sects partners. You get the hormones going, it creates a memorable experience, but it isn't love. And it ends. Girls in particular are by nature more tender (yes, I believe that, and can likely support it empirically, and certainly observationally), and I think starting in this way conditions them to withhold themselves emotionally forever after. They do what is expected of them, physically, but they usually aren't ready for it emotionally, and their growth is thereby stunted.

Noam Chomsky, in his actual contribution, argued that our brains are wired for language. With a lot of stimulation, or very little, most children learn language about the age. This means it is not a matter of quantity, but of biological readiness, IN TANDEM WITH suitable external stimuli.

Morality has a grammar too. It has a structure which ultimately determines the form of our culture, of how we interact, of the happiness we can share, or the misery we cause one another.

Misery and violence are main components of human history. Only with the advent of a moral system founded on tolerance, coupled with the power of self defense, have we begun approaching, as a human race, the ideal of peace.

And yet at the very height of our achievement, the foundation of our nation--our morality, our virtue--is being systematically swept away.

The new Star Wars series has Annakin Skywalker as a hero. We are supposed to identify with him. And yet he becomes Darth Vader. We all know that. The children all know that.

Jigsaw is a hero. Hannibal is a hero. Jason is a hero. Am I the only one who sees a problem here?

I will add, I have made claims on other Rest Days about who Obama MIGHT be. I want to be clear that I am keeping an open mind, and open eyes. I will judge him by what he does, not by what he could do.

Even if he turns out to be a wonderful President, all of these issues will remain. We are turning out moral and intellectual idiots, and it has to stop. The Christian Right is not the enemy. Anomie is, and that is being systematically fostered by large segments of our entertainment/cultural indoctrination industry.

Prole #130

I'm pretty sure I know where you're going with this, but I'll play anyway. Every pseudo libertarian society created has devolved (I'm glad you chose this word, you are aware of its exact definition yes?) into a mixed welfare economy and beyond if given enough time.

I also know that you want to use this information to make an argument based on the naturalistic fallacy (the belief that what is ought to be) and tell me that libertarianism disappears so we shouldn't try to keep it. And that's fine, you are free to believe what you want (at least for now).

But think about this: What is the richest society ever created? What is the most technologically advanced society ever created? The United States of America, the only major nation ever founded on almost libertarian principles. And as we've slowly leaked away from those principles, what has happened?

We've been screwed up more and more and more by government meddling and interventionism and protectionism from both ends of the political spectrum. Look at the current financial situation objetively. Read about the true nature and management of Fannie and Freddie. Look into the community reinvestment act. Look into financial regulation and see what kind of incentives these regulations create. We're setting up companies to fail, then making the taxpayers buttress their failures.

Now look at what's happening with the nationalization bill (some want to call it a bailout, I call it what it is). Every company in the country is coming out of the woodwork with their hand out and companies who have unethically curried political favor are gaining a competitive advantage that they shouldn't have because they're bad companies. GM has misallocated resources for decades, putting all their eggs in the SUV and truck basket. They should pay for that, but lo and behold here comes the nationalization bill with a subsidy written in for the Chevy Volt. Not for hybrid automobiles, only for GM's, which incidentally is one of the more poorly realized hybrids in any kind of production right now.

I'm on a tangent now, so I'll stop. Spit some populist rhetoric if you care to, I'm ready for it.

#137 Jay M.

I'm an independent and don't support all of your views, but Damn Bro....well said!!

i like rest :D

Barry #138

My mistake, I misspoke. I should have said, coming back from the dead is infinitely more improbable than any other natural explanation. As far as I know, billions of people have lived on this earth, and there is no conclusive evidence that any have come back to life after they have passed.

How many times do you have to see something happen before you believe it will always happen? Are billions not enough? This does not make it impossible, just very improbable.

The point is that you seem to believe the less likely explanation. And not just marginally less likely, orders of magnitude less likely. This is something you should probably admit to yourself, and not pretend like you are rational. You believe what you believe in-spite of evidence, not because of it. These are conclusions you have come to of faith, not of reason. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but you are certainly harboring some self delusions about this.

David,

I'll post a response (filled with populist rhetoric of the ripest kind) but not for some time (swamped).

Good and necessary article based on the recent profusion of confused posts by folks whining about politicial discourse on rest days.

My only recommendation to improve the rest day dialogue would be to establish a length limit on individual posts. It would kinda relate to CF timed WOD's to get done in the shortest time possible. It would also relate to the Max effort WOD's in improving one's ability to reduce complex, ponderous topics to their essential elements.

In essence, a CF workout for the mind ! Scoring is unnecessary due to the fact that it is a "rest day" after all.

#137 Jay M.

Many thanks for the heartfelt and thoughtful post. Good stuff.

We are on opposite sides of the political spectrum. But I value your views. I certainly can't dispute what you've seen and experienced.

I think the real question is what it all means -- and what it portends for the future.

It's perfectly true that 57 million people voted for McCain. The flip side is than even more people voted for for an explicitly liberal candidate running on an explicitly liberal platform that included raising taxes on some people.

I don't buy the argument that Obama's victory is a one-shot deal brought about by the economic crisis...and the US remains a center right country. I would even dispute the contention that the US has been center right in recent years. A wealth of polling data shows most Americans have liberal views on issues ranging from health care to social security to the role of government. Republicans have succeeded by mobilizing their base on divisive social issues like gay marriage. That strategy worked -- barely --for a few years. The Republicans were able to achieve some narrow victories. But even these victories were against weak opponents or in the shadow of 9/11.

But times are changing. 89% of Americans favor the prescription drug benefit that is anathema to many conservatives. Only 12% oppose higher taxes on the top 5%. This year, the Democrats got 67% of the Hispanic vote and 95% of the African-American vote.
If those numbers persist, the Republicans can't win. The numbers just don't add up.

I would respectfully invite you to consider what must, for you, be an unattractive possibility: the country is moving to the left.
And on many key issues of the day -- global warming, gay rights, social security, health care -- the Republican party advocates policies that are both mistaken and unpopular.

Republicans are likely to respond to their defeat by lurching even further to the right. The British Labour Party made a similar mistake in the 80's. In response to Maggie Thatcher, they picked one loonie lefty after another and suffered defeat after defeat. They thought they had to offer a clear alternative by purging themselves of moderates and becoming more "pure."

I think it's quite likely the Republicans will make the same mistake. The last of the moderates is gone. And many Republicans think the only problem with their party is that it is
insufficiently conservative. The evidence points in the opposite direction -- the party is TOO conservative and TOO out of touch with mainstream opinion. It's quite likely the libertarian, fiscal conservative, social conservative, and big business elements of the party will be at each others' throats for years -- as Democrats win election after election.

Eventually, the Republicans will realize they have to move to the center. But it could take a long time.

In the meantime, the Democrats have gotten a lot smarter. They no longer talk about gun control. They have recruited Iraq War veterans as candidates. They have stolen the tax cut idea by proposing them for 95% of the population. And their health plan lets you keep the insurance you have, if you like it. have also figured out the whole "people-powered" Internet thing. Republicans haven't. Why not?

If the Republicans were smart, they would focus on building a bigger tent. For instance, there are plenty of conservative and entrepreneurial Hispanics. And business people and those earning over $100,000 increasingly vote Democratic. Why not focus on these groups.

#146 Daniel

I guess we must, agree to disagree. When true conservatism is on the ballot, it wins, and I will repeat, I do not vote Republican as a rule. I agree this country has moved left in the urban Northeast and West, but most people voted this election with their "pocketbook" and the Republicans' stump was so poorly communicated and left much to be desired for conservatives. If America is moving left, how do we explain the many jurisdictions where issues like Prop. 8 in California (of all places) won out for conservatives.
I understand where your argument emerges, and really don't disagree that Conservatives have a long way to go to right this ship, but I must contend again, that We are ready to "fight", and we will. Many of us are tired of the appeasement of "political correctness", as we say in our CrossFit group, "its on now brother, bring it!!" I think you will see that sentiment be quite pervasive among Conservatives, so brace yourself, "the gloves are coming off".

#146: I won't dispute the country has moved to the left. The Left owns our educational system, and has since at least the 1960's. Intelligent children, fed what they are fed by our system, will invariably become liberals.

Some of us continue learning, and become conservatives. Distressingly many people think they learned what they need to know in school, and only need the occasional support from public media.

The fly in your ointment is that true conservatism (hint, hint, buying GM would make Barry Goldwater roll over in his grave) works. It just does. It fosters prosperity and equality.

Leftism fosters economic malaise, moral corruption, and lifelong dependency on the government.

If Obama keeps his campaign promises, the experts I trust predict not a recession, but a depression.

You have to remember, that Obama did not factor into his rhetoric that Bush's tax cuts run out this year. That means everyone's taxes will go up.

True conservatism is cutting the size of the government, along with lower taxes. Given the very real demographics you describe, we can only get it implemented the way we are going: giving Democrats more than enough rope to hang themselves.

This is a very dicy business. We as a nation are going to have enormous stresses inflicted on us. Certainly economic troubles much larger than most can imagine, if Obama goes full steam ahead, and quite possibly more terror attacks.

How we respond will dictate whether we deserve to survive as a Constitutional Republic. Right now, I'm so disgusted with so many people, I'm not sure we do. I am particularly mad at the entirety of our mainstream media, and our educational system, from Kindergarten through Ph.D. The whole lot is corrupt.

Interesting "leftward" & "rightward" thoughts.

IMHO, the "center" in American politics doesn't move much unless provoked. What moves "leftward & rightward" is government (State & National). The perceived movement to the "left" is actually a move back toward the "center". This movement is much like a pendulum, who's arc and velocity is affected by current events, and the political reaction to them. Like pendulums, its movement back toward the center will invariably swing past it, and will cause another reaction in the body politic. The extent of its swing past the center will drive the timing and strength of this reaction.

On a separate, but related note: What fascinates me about the Republican party is how liberally the views of moralists & the religious minded have debased its conservative agenda and infused its membership with folks who are not politically conservative.

((Historical example: The majority of northern religious activists carrying right to life signs back in the 1960's were most definitely not Republicans at the time. The dissenting (Conservative) opinion in Roe V. Wade was simply that it was a states rights issue. The folks who objected to this decision on moral grounds migrated into the Republican party (Remember the "moral majority"?), and the rest is history)).

This confusion has been addressed by the formation of the Libertarian movement. (Who's agenda used to be espoused the conservative wing of the Republican party).

Barry.

I've come accross some of these leftist rednecks myself. But I think they're pretty rare. Thier thoroughgoing relativism is more stylistic than ideological, more a matter of fashion than moral commitment. My advice would be to approach this fauna with a soft touch, not to make any sudden movements that could alarm them (i.e. don’t call them names like: “leftist”, "leninist” “unpatriotic”). All you need to do is put them at ease so that they think they can still be fashionable while making positive judgments.

Dave.

I think of myself as much more of a cosmopolitan liberal elitist than a populist. I generally look down on most people, not because I’ve accomplished more than them, but because I can drop the names of weighty books easier than them, and also because I buy my organic fair trade coffee from people with tattoos and graduate degrees.

I actually agree with much of your post (see my comment #80). Where I think we would disagree is the historical arch you chart. The quasi-libertarian society that existed (for men) in the early non-slave US is likely impossible now. We can no longer maintain the fiction of a teraa nullus. And, I see much of the US prosperity and success as an enduringly wealthy and free nation as made possible by the growth of a huge, educated middle class. I think it extremely unlikely that this would have developed on the scale that it did without things like the welfare state, labour unions and subsidized public goods. I don’t think that a mass libertarian society would necessarily devolve into some form of totalitarianism. I do think it would likely result in class warfare, and in the worse case scenario end up totalitarian, and in a better scenario, end up in a mixed economy welfare state with enshrined civil rights and the rule of law such as exists presently in the US, Canada, Australia and Britain. I think we can discuss government waste and inefficiency. Like Marx’s critique of capital, the libertarian critique of the modern state is penetrating. But I think that Marxism and libertarianism both fall short when they move from critique to prescription – both seem to say: “reality be damned, this is the way things should be” (in the first instance based on scientific/historical grounds, in the second instance on moral/naturalistic grounds. Like Hume, I prefer folks to make their moral presumptions/sentiments explicit, and not to pretend that their moral conclusions (what ought to be) result from supposedly value-neutral judgments about “history”, or “human nature” (what is) – this is the counterpoint to the naturalistic fallacy you seemed to have found in my previous post. You say I make the mistake of saying that if something is not, this means it ought not to be. I say you make the mistake of saying that what ought to be, ought to be regardless of what is.

I like Aristotle’s golden mean and his polity of a mixed constitution (also Montesquieu’s) with a heavy dose of Mill's liberty, and that’s why I like the US republican constitution backed by a Bill of Rights and the Westminster parliamentary system (backed in some cases by a Charter of Rights and in all cases by the common law). To my mind, libertarianism places too much emphasis on the rule of law and too little emphasis on political participation. The first provides for stability (short-term), the second provides for flexibility. Both are required, and where both have existed they have resulted in the free-est and wealthiest societies the world has known, and they have been mixed economies.

..."and our educational system, from Kindergarten through Ph.D. The whole lot is corrupt."

And this is fostering dialogue? This is the intellectual debate that Rest Day is supposed to engender?

Speaking as a dedicated educator, how dare you.

Leftist redneck ought to be redundant- the term originated from coal miners wearing red bandanas in solidarity for the right to unionize.

Prole- Do you talk about Jews the way you do Rednecks? What would Hume think?

In the words of Kris Kristoferson -

"Everybody has to have somebody to look down on- if cant find nobody else- help yourself to me."

James,

By the time I got into the "Leftist Redneck" discussion at #130 I was poking a little fun at Barry's initial use of the term at #100. I think both "Redneck" and "Leftist" are silly obfuscating terms that play to one group's preoccupations when they are used on their own. But when they were put together by Barry at #100, I thought it was a laugh - I had hoped Barry might give as a comical mock-encyclopedia entry for this "fauna" as a I called it.

Anyway, Hume talks to me every night before I go to bed (I flatter myself he finds me interesting, but I suspect he's actually checking to see if my wife is home alone). I'll ask him what he thinks of my manner of speaking about "Leftist Rednecks" tonight and report back to you tomorrow.

Ryan #151,

In re "The whole lot is corrupt."

To quote Joe Klein:

"Cynicism is what passes for insight among the mediocre."

In what form does Hume materialize ?

Greg,

I know, it's literally a miracle that Hume's able to talk to me the way he does. Anyway, he wears a blue toga (it's a shade of blue I don't think I've ever seen before), and he's always bugging me to play billiards. He has a chatty dog named Karl Popper with the most embarassing habit of dragging its rear across the lawn while the neighbours are out.

Prole that is way too funny ! Hume in a blue toga and a dog named Karl Popper...Keep it coming ;)

Do you teach philosophy ?

Barry Cooper wrote: "How we respond will dictate whether we deserve to survive as a Constitutional Republic. Right now, I'm so disgusted with so many people, I'm not sure we do. I am particularly mad at the entirety of our mainstream media, and our educational system, from Kindergarten through Ph.D. The whole lot is corrupt."

I feel ya man. A wise friend of mine said that he does not get mad any longer when pagans act like pagans. But he does get angry when Christians act like pagans. Barry, if you are a Christian, remember that this world, and all its glitter, is passing away. We who live by faith are just passing through as ambassadors for Christ. This present world is not our eternal home. We should, and many of us do, take good care of it while we are here, but apart from what we as individuals can and should do for however many future generations live before Christ returns; we need not worry that the world is going to hell. The Bible says that the whole world is already condemned.

We Christians need only tell the world that forgiveness and escape from an eternity in a place the Bible calls Hell, is available to anyone who is willing to turn from their sins, and place their trust in Jesus Christ.

Jay M.

Conservatives and Republicans may be ready for a fight, but face many long term challenges. See the Nov. 13 article on the topic at www.pollster.com (w/f/s)

Excerpts:

Some will say that we lost the election because McCain was unable to energize the base, despite his selection of Sarah Palin for Vice President. I disagree that a more conservative candidate would have fared better in the election. In fact, it isn't so much that the "base" sat home - for instance, in 2004, 23% of the electorate identified as "white evangelical/born-again Christian". In 2008, that jumped to 26% - larger than the jump in those identifying as 18-29 (18%, up from 17% in '04) or the jump in African-American turnout (13%, up from 11% in '08).

The base didn't sit home. They came out. Many Republicans just weren't calling themselves Republicans anymore, and many weren't voting like Republicans either. This speaks more to moderates and independents fleeing the GOP than a lack of turnout on the part of the base. Take a look here at my firm's website for two instructive charts that show the trends over time (the last 24 years - not the totality of political history to be sure - but the time frame since 2002 is particularly instructive).

(chart omitted here)

McCain could have fought this election in the middle and perhaps stopped or at least stifled the exodus. Instead, the McCain campaign fought a traditional turn-out-the-base campaign - a tragic failure of strategy in a year where McCain's money and organization would barely be able to keep up with the Obama juggernaut. The way to win was to appeal to independents - something that it looked like might happen following the conventions, when some polls briefly showed a glimmer of hope that the maverick narrative would take hold. Instead, the campaign was fought on a battlefield where there was little way McCain could win short of a miracle.

The big change everyone was preparing to discuss after this election was the surge in youth and African-American turnout. This change was not at all as dramatic as many expected. Additionally, the Republican base doesn't appear to have stayed home in large numbers - in fact, they may have come out better than anticipated. The big shift in the makeup of the electorate came in the decreased percentage of the electorate identifying as Republican - something that requires a great deal of attention given the usual stability of party ID. Democrats only gained another 2% of the electorate, far less than many public polls had predicted or had shown in their own party ID breaks, but this election did show that while Party ID is still "sticky", it is also malleable as a variable in elections. The GOP needs to take action - and soon - to win those Independent voters back who have strayed if it wants to improve its electoral success any time soon.

only word that came out of my mouth after watching connor

"dayummm"

"Periwinkle Blue"

that pikey was a crossfitter if there ever was one...

Heh, I thought this was supposed to be fitness site? Why the hell are we talking about politics?

Greg,

No, I'm not a philosophy teacher though I did do a year toward a PhD in the subject. I still like the stuff, but now read mostly politically related philosophy and intellectual history.

I did it in 10:35 as RX'ed if anyone still cares about that stuff.

Prole- ha - I didnt get the context- sorry- just taking up for my fambly

Daniel

You bring up some very good dilemmas that America will face, and I appreciate your dialogue. This country is very divided, no doubt, and with the diversity that makes America so great comes the different challenges you've mentioned. The folks, like myself, who value independent thinking and the freedom to make choices for our health, wealth, and faith, will honestly fight for these rights. We must, lest we lose them to a Socialist Totalatarianistic gov't, regardless of how benevolent it is presented.

My only point is that the "Left" shouldn't expect us to roll over and just accept: Partial Birth Abortion, Deletion of God from America, Gay Marriage, Leagalized Marijauna, Unrestricted Stem Cell Research, Gun and Ammo Bans, Increased Taxation, Larger and more powerful Gov't programs (ie: Welfare) Just because there was a shift in 4% of the vote from 4 yr ago does not dictate to me or any other conservative what our values should be or that these are right or ethical.

I honestly believe, because I've worked "with the public" in 3 regions of this country, that the "masses" are grossly ignorant of the issues and the consequences of most of the decision any of our politicians make. Also, humans are by nature corrupt, selfish, and desire to be a "God unto themselves", so why would I care how the American Populace has been "shifted by the winds of economic and social opinions" of the drive-by media, Hollywood, Mr. Sorros and the like, etc, etc. Our values and opinions, as Conservatives, have not changed, and we will "go to war" to defend them....that is for sure.

Thanks for your contribution here, b/c although I am very certain in my position and convictions on these issues, it is always a privilege to have the freedom to debate respectfully with someone of your character. God Bless you, and may God Bless America and Pres-elect Obama.

Jay Montgomery

Jay:

Thanks for the thanks.

I agree that much of the public is ill-informed about many issues. But, when asked, it takes the "liberal" side on most of the issues you mention. The big exceptions would be gun control and taxes.

The Democrats have stopped talking about gun control. It cost them too many elections in the past. Obama also promised middle-class tax cuts, stealing the Republicans most effective
policy.

I agree that a 4% swing in Democratic support is not huge. But, in a way, it only reinforces my point -- the Republicans greatly
overplayed their hand in 2000-2008. They mistook narrow presidential victories for sweeping mandates and failed on such matters as social security privatization.

Now the Republicans are in danger of moving even further to the right. That would be a mistake.

Daniel,

I guess we'll just see, b/c many people with more political savvy than me feel a Conservative movement by whatever party will win elections. Its definitely what I pray for and I believe God is still in control.

I hope you are wrong. :-)

Have a good week, enjoyed the conversation.

Coonor you are awsome, and I know you put in he work to get the results. I'm around Croddfit kids all the time and it's hard to see how much it has grown. Just like when being around a puppy you don't really see it grow untill someone who hasn't says man that pup has grown. Well with the Crossfit Kids it's times like this with a 2:30 Fran time that you really see it. Congrats to all our Kids who are just amazing and growing stronger and smarter.

Ooops.

Just realized some of the numbers above are off.

The swing in presidential voting from 2004 to 2008 was 10 percentage points. It went from +3 Republican to +7 Democratic.

LEFT,RIGHT,LIBERAL,CONSERVATIVE, IT IS ALL AN ILLUSION. MASS HYSTERIA BUILT UP BY TWO WARRING IDEOLOGIES WHOSE SOLE PURPOSE IS TO EXACT THERE FORM OF COLLECTIVISM THAT WILL EVENTUALLY ENCOMPASS THIS WORLD. WE HAVE BEEN ON THIS PATH SINCE THE ADVENT OF THE FEDERAL RESERVE, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS, TRILATERAL COMMISSION, RAND CORPORATION TO NAME A FEW. SEE "REPORT FROM IRON MOUNTAIN" SECRET MEETING HELD IN 1966 AMONGST INTELLECTUALS ON HOW TO KEEP SOCIETY SUBSERVIENT, BLOODY SCARY. U WILL DISCOVER WHERE GLOBAL WARMING CAME FROM (ENVIRONMENTAL-POLLUTION METHOD)OF CREATING MASS HYSTERIA IN NON-VIOLENT WAY. WAR DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE. IT ALL ABOUT MONETARY CONTROL FOLKS, ALWAYS HAS BEEN, BOOM & BUSTS ARE CREATED TO CONTINUE SPREADING THE GAP BETWEEN RICH AND POOR WHETHER IT IS A DEMOCRATIC OR REPUBLICAN GOVT. SEE HISTORY OF THE 20TH CENTURY ECONOMICS FOR PROOF.
WE ARE HEADING FOR A NEW WORLD ORDER, GLOBAL GOVT. (UN), EUROPEAN UNION WAS THE FIRST STEP, NEXT UP IS NORTH AMERICAN UNION (SEE AMERO CURRENCY)U CAN KISS YOUR FREEDOMS GOODBYE, IF U CONTINUE TO ALLOW YOURSELF TO BE SUBJECTED TO THE MIRAGE OF RIGHT VS. LEFT POLITICS.

Shawn,

I have two questions for you:

1) In your opinion, what would be an instance of international cooperation addressing a fundamentally international problem, that is not motivated by, or does not tend toward illiberal world government?

2) Will my freedoms give me tongue on the way out?

I am very impressed by the crossfit website. The workouts have made me stronger and faster than I have ever been before and I am continually inspired and educated by the videos posted on the site.

However, I am not a big fan of the partisan articles posted on the site on rest days. I'm glad that it took awhile before I noticed them or I might have dismissed the whole site as some partisan political/fitness thing before I really got to know what it offers. One thing that impressed me so much about crossfit from the beginning was their inclusiveness. The idea that anyone could do crossfit, and all the workouts could be scaled down to that person's fitness level. It wasn't snobby at all, but there was still an incredibly high level of fitness and expectations for greatness. Dragging politics, especially partisan political writings, into this mix is unnecessary and alienating. Whenever I see those articles and some of the subsequent comments, I am just reminded of how I don't fit in with this group. Instead, and especially on an exercise web site, I think we should be focusing on what we all have in common. We could certainly continue having endless lively debating when it comes to fitness, and I think the Coach could still demonstrate his philosophies more specifically without making things political. For example, his support of the troops and the hero workouts show what's important to him, and they're positive aspects of this site that everyone can get behind and feel good about.

Prole,

1. There isn't. In my opinion, every international incident/movement etc. of the 20/21 century has been based on our eventual direction towards global govt, directed by the monetary(international financiers)& political (multi-national organizations) scientists of our time.
read "The Creature from Jekyl Island" Ron Paul endorsed it.
Most people would consider it conspiracy theory crap, like I did at one time, but once I delved deep into connecting the dots, it changed the way I looked at politics and its effect on society.

I enjoy the the "rest day" articles. I find them refreshing and they challenge me to think and "think again". I'll admit that I'm more "right" and "conservative" in my thinking and a bit libertarian concerning social issues. Yet, this doesn't mean I agree with all the posts. So what? They are still interesting and always thought provoking.

It is my observation that so called "leftist" and "liberals" are more likely to complain about the posts. I thought they were the ones who were all for freedom of expression? If you don't like what you read, respond to it and let your opinion be known. Or don't read them if they cause you so much consternation. You are in control of how what you read and how you respond. It really is that simple.

Hope #175 - I totally see where you're coming from, but for me, the point is that it gets exhausting logging on every Rest Day to see an article that is from one side of the political spectrum only. Yes, we can debate it and put up a contrary view, but the purpose of Rest Day article selection is not articulated anywhere on this site. Even article here was to two views from contributors. I don't know what the official reasoning is. So it seems like powerful dissemination of ideas and ideology and source materials for one side of the political spectrum only. In a manner that is simply not up front and honest. (It's not dishonest, that's too strong, but it's not articulated anywhere). Saying that the site is as it is and that if you don't like it you can leave is something of a departure from the interactive shared resource it purports to be, so this is, to my mind, a legitimate view and a legitimate comment.

I'd like to see either some balance in the selection of articles (which to my mind would be great and help everybody get exposed to different sources and world-views) or I'd like the site to openly acknowledge that it only puts up articles form one side, tell me why it does that and back up the decisions. As it is, I and others I know are turned off Rest Day because it's the same old ding-dong every time. And I believe many logging on for the first time will see this right-wing stuff and be turned off - a simple FAQ or link would just seem sensible, but I've said this before and I seem to be in a minority so I'll shut up now. I am fast losing interest in Rest Day discussion though, because of the feeling of constantly swimming against a tide. It gets tiring and it seems unfair.

Peace.

#50 mtschanz, #171 Shawn,

Caps lock - it's like cruise control for cool, Baby!

With respect to education, let me just offer one example. High school students were interviewed in Washington D.C. around the time the monument to WW2 was being opened.

Roughly twice as many students knew that Roosevelt had imprisoned the Japanese as could name a single U.S. General in the war.

High school students today ALL seem to graduate thinking "McCarthyism" is more evil than Communism. They know Hitler killed the Jews, but they don't know Stalin killed the Kulaks.

They don't understand economics, they don't know U.S. history, and they don't know world history. They are blank sheets, upon which can be written virtually anything.

Education--knowledge--is essential for self rule. Why would you entrust a nation to someone who is ignorant? How can a people that is ignorant be trusted?

Common sense isn't. There are many, many brilliant aspects of our system of government, and the Electoral College and Representative Democracy are two of them. The latter can ensure that even if the People are dumb, at least the people making legislation need not be. However the caliber of the pool of candidates, pari passu with the population as a whole, seems to be getting lower and lower with each passing year.

I'm a grumpy old man who isn't old. I try and convice myself that it's just me, that people are really all still the same, just different in the packaging.

But, objectively, I don't think people know as much now--about anything but science and technology--as they did 50 years ago.

And to return to the topic of today, how could political dialogue exceed in quality the caliber of knowledge brought to the table? You can't Google large scale historical maps. You can Google Napoleon, or Lenin. You can't Google how either integrates culturally and philosophically with global history. You have to work for those understandings, and that takes time.

Few people want to take that time any more.

Again: grumpy old man.

Daniel,

You're discussing the mechanics of maintaining power. I don't dispute that the edge is with the Democrats now, and likely to remain so, absent major developments.

However, the point of power is not power. It is the proper use of power, and I don't think the Democrats really have any idea about how to help people do anything.

"The Road to serfdom" can be summarized very simply by the observation that ignorant use of power leads to coercive use of power.

Bush is not a conservative. He gets labelled "right wing", but I fail to see how he merits it. He pledged $700 billion in government aid to private enterprise. He kept or increased virtually all of the social programs started by Democrats, even with a Republican Congress. He INCREASED the size of government, with the Dept. of Homeland Security.

The point of propaganda is to create dichotomies. It is to make your enemies seem worse than they are, and your own side better than it is. In the case of Bush, he is simply a Truman-esque Democrat. Truman would have gone into Iraq, too.

We need someone who is a true conservative. I do feel there is a hunger for a real choice. McCain was not a true conservative. If you think going back to our roots is a bad idea, maybe it is. But the reality is, we already have a Democratic Party. We don't need two of them.

Weighing in a little late, but awesome job Connor. It has been a joy watching you grow up.

Weighing in a little late, but awesome job Connor. It has been a joy watching you grow up.

Hi #176-J1

Thanks for your response to my post, and no, you should not feel compelled to "shut up" though you may be in the minority. You are doing a fine job of making my earlier point in that you have responded with your thoughts and feelings(and in a very articulate fashion). You have done your part to contribute to the dialog.

I agree with you that the rest day post represents a particular point of view. Yet, I don't think they are under any obligation to post opposing views. If the owners of this site choose to represent their views I think it's fine for them to do so. They pay for site, own it and maintain it, it's theirs to post what they want. They are not pretending to be unbiased or "fair". I only wish the mainstream media were more open about their bias...big pretenders that they are!(oops, I'm showing my "right" side again.)

Allow me to show why it is not always unfair to be "unbalanced". Let's say I joined the Sierra Club. I love hiking so that is a real possibility for me. Now I know that their website is going to reflect views quite opposite to mine most of the time. I wouldn't ask the Sierra Club to post opposing views. They own the site and can post what they want to promote. I might choose to respond and give them my opinion. They have a viewpoint, an agenda, and that's okay; I get it and I disagree with it. I might choose to "shut up" because I (like you said)would grow tired of being constantly put in a position of having to define and defend my opposing view; I simply might not find it worth the time.

By the way, we both feel bombarded by views we disagree with. I feel that way every single day that I listen to the news, watch T.V. and because I live on the "left coast" I am really in the minority!

And yet...I greatly celebrate this democracy and our freedom to this open dialog.

On a different note...train hard, train smart and keep Crossfitting!

Be well.

Hope.

Barry Cooper

QUOTE
Bush is not a conservative. He gets labelled "right wing", but I fail to see how he merits it.
ENDQUOTE

I don't know where you're posting from but I do think West Coast Conservatism is far different than much of the rest of the country, particular the South where Republicans are the strongest.

If 5% of Republicans here, in NC, have ever heard Hayek, I would be shocked. If 20% even cared to hear someone talk about Libertarian principles I would be equally shocked.

I would say there is large minority of Republicans here who care about low taxes, though most don't care at all about spending. Yes, the cognitive dissonance is deep.

The rest tolerate the tax cutters because they hope they can push a pro-Christian agenda. However, they are as much economic leftist as any Democrats and indeed many see Big Government as Chrisitian because Christ said "whatever you do unto the least of my breathern you do unto me"

Most Libertarians I know here are Democrats. Indeed, I think that might be common around the country because if you take one the "World's Smallest Political Tests" it asks who you voted for in 2004. Most of the people in the Libertarian Quadrant voted for Kerry.

Karl Smith wrote:
...many see Big Government as Christian because Christ said: "whatever you do unto the least of my brethren you do unto me."

-------------------------------------------
If that be true, then how might those who support abortion appear to Christ?

Hitler was responsible for the death of approximately 11 million people during the holocaust.

Since January 22, 1973 (the year murder became legal in America), approximately 46 million babies have been slaughtered through abortion. That is four times more then Hitler!

Luke 17:1-3:
Then He (Jesus) said to the disciples, "It is impossible that no offenses should come, but woe to him through whom they do come! It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were thrown into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones. NKJV

Food for thought:
If anyone reading this has had or supported abortion in the past, please know that God is willing to forgive you. Though you have offended one of His little ones as Luke 17:1-3 puts it, God has already poured out His wrath for sin on His one and only Son at the cross on Calvary.

If you turn from your sin and accept the free gift of grace from God He provided through His Sons death on the cross, you can be assured that when you stand before Him on Judgment Day you will not be condemned. And just as Christ has risen from the grave in victory, so will you!

Now that is Cross-Fit!

Hope #182, I would agree that:

1. They're not under a legal obligation to put up views from a different end of the policital spectrum on a site that they own; and

2. Many who pretend to be neutral in the media and elsewhere are not neutral and are not up front about it.

But I do think there is something unseemly about putting up libertarian and right wing articles all the time and not having anywhere on the site explain that this is the inherent bias of the site. If Rest Day is about intellectual training, then surely it would serve them well to put up "leftist" articles? But they don't. So is Rest Day partly about intellectual training but also partly about influencing people politically by steering them toward a particular world view? If so, I think they should be explicit about it. Because that's not fitness - physical or mental. No legal obligation here, but I do think there's a moral obligation.

Also, you're recognising the legitimacy of someone posting this view on the site. And thank you for that. To me, if this is truly a collaborative source and "the line between consumer and producer is blurred" then this line of reasoning, i.e., "I don't like the constant right wing articles" is a legitimate comment. But unfortunately, increasingly, there is a chorus of disapproval and abuse when someone says this or something similar and I don't like that.

Anyway, today's article seems to be another pro-libertarian article and frankly, I can't be arsed spending the time reading it and posting because I've read enough libertarian articles now to last me for a while. This is starting to feel like a vehicle for repeated and sustained promotion of one person's political ideology. I'm not sure at all how libertarians feel about charity, famine relief, the whole inequality on the planet - I find the slant I do pick up quite Darwinian and chilling. It's naive in its belief that everyone can work individually towards greater wealth. It assumes that a truly free market is achievable. All well and good until you're sick, old, unemployed or facing discrimination.

The constant torrent of right wing articles now feels like "my ball, my rules". So I'm not going to play anymore. I'm going to have a coffee instead.

Nothing but good wishes to the people who run the site, who have revolutionised my fitness, and to those here with differing views.

Peace.

FOR ALL OF YOU WHO WANT A DEFINITION OF "INFIDEL" HERE IT IS:

Oh and by the way, you were all right in that you can apply the term to religious beliefs or more loosely to theories or systems that you are skeptical of. So all of us, including the atheists, can find reason to wear the shirt, (aside from the fact you just like the color), and pretty much annoy somebody.

in⋅fi⋅del   /ˈɪnfɪdl, -ˌdɛl/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [in-fi-dl, -del] Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun 1. Religion. a. a person who does not accept a particular faith, esp. Christianity.
b. (in Christian use) an unbeliever, esp. a Muslim.
c. (in Muslim use) a person who does not accept the Islamic faith; kaffir.

2. a person who has no religious faith; unbeliever.
3. (loosely) a person who disbelieves or doubts a particular theory, belief, creed, etc.; skeptic.