typo! im guessing that friday is really suppose to be tuesday.

Does anybody know any olympic lifters in the Hunterdon County New Jersey area??

Or Anyone that needs a CF partner for that matter

I'm going for "Nancy" tomorrow.

I did cleans again tonight and got up to body weight. PR by 15 pounds.

Is it bad to do them again tomorrow? I think I can do more and I'm excited to try it.

Allison be cautious of overtraining! Btw, great job on cleans--full sq cleans??

Oh and how was the zone/paleo today? Hunger is normal and should be expected. How many blocks you at?

Way to go Allison. So do we have a new girl on our hands? Huh? Or have I been living in a cave and missed something? Kyle S.

curvy women huh? i'll have to get me one of those!

Huh, that's really interesting. Good thing I love curvy women ;) It'll balance out my dumb genes :P

Nice work Pat. I'll give Christine a try tomorrow.

6'2" 210 lbs
fran (21-15-9)- 10:55
135 thruster, bw pullups

backstory: forgot my mp3 player today, and the gym was packed. i got pissed and figured i should just go ahead and scrap the standard plan and try my first xfit workout. i have to ruck 18 miles saturday anyway; why not screw up the whole week?

i was happy with it until i watched greg's heavy fran workout.

just made up Liz

28/f/108

10:53

75# cleans
ring dips

3 min slower but 10# heavier on cleans and no assist on ring dips.

tomorrow will make up nancy and weighted pull-ups

Ken C- thanks for the kick in the ass to get me back in the gym and back on the zone. i actually had a decent day today, AND no grey goose! ;-)

QUESTION: Does anyone know if you have to sub regular pull-ups and dips for MU's can you scale it down in number if you add weight???? Is there a ratio for that?

I dunno about this new study. It smacks of "frontier science" and I'm always suspect when only one spectrum of the news media picks up on something.

Also, it doesn't seem to touch on total percentage of bodyfat or dietary habits or general fitness habits. Is it better to have lower bodyfat with a lean figure or higher bodyfat with an hour glass figure?

I'm not buying this one.

I'll have to read the article tomorrow, but sometimes I just like to look at the title and guess if it's going to be a 300+ comment kind of day. This title made me smile. Can't wait to read everyone's thoughts tomorrow.

Yeah full squat cleans at 120. It didn't feel too hard. My form actually got a little better as I went up. When I was doing the 95#s I wasn't opening my hips and was pulling with my arms.
I think I can do at least 5 more pounds.

Would it be better to wait a day?

The Zone is way better than I expected. I'm not hungry at all and I feel lighter. Before the Zone I was eating so much that I felt tired, heavy and hungry all the time. I can't wait to see how I feel in a few weeks.
I'm doing 10 blocks.

I know my body fat will go down but does is the Zone going to help me gain muscle faster? I'm really curious about this.

I want to be lighter, have less fat and more muscle.

My coach explained the benefit of losing fat this way: Think about carrying around a ten pound weight all day long and working out with it. You would want to put it down right? When you put it down you'd be able to move faster, do more pull-ups..

I've never been lighter than I am now so I can't wait to see what it feels like to workout.

Allison are you doing it with paleo foods too?

Peanuts, organic polly-o, apples, chicken, lemons, olives, egg whites...
I don't know anything about Paleo. Do you recommend it? I'll start looking into it.

Everyone has their own personal philosophy on how to live their life, and this study fits some people's ideas. Whoop dee doo. If you're a go getter and want to do cool stuff like backpack through Algonquin, or climb mountains in the Rockies, or crawl across weird rock formations, or simply LIVE like we were created and evolved towards, well heck, guess what? You have to work at it. Now, if you want to coast along and be gee whiz about life, well, enjoy the study's program.

But maybe the article is some half baked reflection on what an image of a woman is supposed to be? Personally, partnership is what I strive for and that means adventuring to way out places whenever responsibility and obligation allows, and I hate to say it, soft women, like soft men can't do those things.

And heck, that's not addressing a woman's lively hood that involves, say fire fighting, or serving as a police officer or in the military. Heck, I'll make an opinionated guess and risk ridicule, but was this study written conducted by men who like women to be weaker than them? Eeek.

I'll stick to training hard and hateful, and when and if I am lucky enough to get past 65, I'll count that as the bonus plan.

Nice work Pat! You should come work out with us in SF. Did Tony show you the footage of our 'Sandy Grace'?

-Adrian

Mike Myer (#2 above): Check your yahoo inbox . . . just sent you a message.

Having only read the abstract and not seen the data, I would be a little reluctant to put too much weight in it.

I'm not sure about the author's basic assumption that their measures of cognitive ability are relevent in the "hunter/gatherer" sense where selective pressure would have favored this sort of mate selection. "Cognitive ability" is a pretty ambigous measure of adaptive fitness I would say (and in fairness I will add that as an ecologist I am biased towards measuring fitness using 'survival', 'number of offspring' etc as actual measurments of how some trait may enable you to promote your genes in a population).

Just off the top of my head, wouldn't a more obvious explanation be that a woman with larger hips would have greater success during child birth and a better chance of rapid recovery (at least back in the days before paterety leave), thus enabling them to have more offspring and pass on the genes of themselves and their mates etc? I'm suspect there are lots of studies out there with more straightforward explanations. I would add that it's important to be cautious when drawing conclusions from correlations

But look at it in print! "Curvey (i.e., Hot) chicks have smarter kids!". You just sold me a paper New York Post...

Are you gonna take me home tonight
Ah, down beside that red firelight
Are you gonna let it all hang out
Fat bottomed girls, you make the rockin world go round

29/m/145

11 hour workday, then weighted pull ups (no kipping). Previous PR was 75 pounds.

55-60-65-75-85(PR)-95-95(PR)

Holy crap! Something must have suddenly clicked because I was able to pull so much more. I probably could have even gone higher, but my gym doesn't have any heavier dumbells. Next time, I'm going to bring a rope to tie some of them together and really scare all the guys next to me who were doing pull ups with half range of motion!

so we like curves. somehow i always knew they were a good thing. also have read that women prefer a certain hip to waist ratio in men too. anything around .85 (e.g. 33 waist, 39 hips).

nadia

i got your back.

That study really doesn't seem to be about fitness so much as proportions - I'd be curious to get an idea of what some of the long-time female crossfitters' waist-to-hip ratio is compared with some of the less-fit girls. I wouldn't be at all surprised if fit women have a rather low WHR - certainly all those squats are putting on muscle in all the right places.

Fantastic work Pat! 8:22 SERIOUSLY, 8:22?! Amazing, you are a bad ass!

Christine was the intro workout Dave Warner had me do on my first visit to Crossfit North. I'd been crossfitting 1 year, and had never rowed before, that workout almost killed me. 11:22 was my time i believe. I hope to never meet christine again...god she is evil, legs are like jello by the time the box jumps come along.

I find it interesting people talking about the different diets. I was scared to try it, but I decided a month ago to eat paleo, only because I felt I wasn't eating enough fruit and vegetables. I actually find it really easy. I don't miss my bread, rice and pastas, and I have become addicted to my morning omelette. I definitely recommend it.

What is it - lean meats, fruit, vegetables, nuts, seeds and eggs. Caveman style.

My only cheat is Dutch wheat beer. Sorry, it just tastes too damn good.

JPratt....that's my song! Anyone who quotes Queen must know what they're talking about.

As for the study... I'm alright with that info. If it's true, my kids will be very successful. :)

Got to do the weighted pull-ups today.

22/m/180lbs

30-40-45-50-60-65(PR)-70(PR)-80(PR)

Last time I did this I was also 10lbs lighter.

Damn Pat is fast!
I don't think I've ever seem someone DL or Box jump so fast.

Was that a wide DL stance? I feel like my feet are a lot closer together. What would be the reason or a wider one? Is it whatever feels comfortable?

Darling Patrick, what a sweetie AND a badass!

25/M/5'8"/160
did 30 mucleups for time after pullups.
Still cant do a muscleup so I would try as hard as I could and when I failed each time I jumped up and did a ring dip.
took me 14 minutes.
After I was done I put on some bmx gloves and tried a muscle up and got it the first try. I guess I just need to work on my false grip. Only had my rings for 2 weeks. I think i'm really close to getting one. Never thought they would be so hard.

Maybe not. I looked at some videos with DLs and it looks pretty much the same.

#26 lara
Hey don't give me too much credit, Im just a skinny lad, never knew no good from bad. But a shape so lovely and enticing even Freddy Mercury had to sing about it deserves some investigating.

thanks adrian! no i have not seen the sandy grace footage yet but i know Tony will show it to me now that you have mentioned it. I would love to come workout sometime up in sf with you just let me know when a good time would be and ill head up.

Pat

Pullups +70, +90, +115, +115, +115, +115, +115. New PR!

Allison,
I've heard that taller people are more comfortable with a wider, or even a sumo stance. I've tried it out before and feel it a lot more in my hamstrings. I'd just try a few stances out and work with what's comfortable.

Curves, I knew they served a purpose other than making me smile.

Nadia- Jolie and I were just wondering today how you did on Elizabeth. Jolie mentioned someting about wishing there was a separate comment section for women so she could compare with the rest of you chicas out there a little more easily than sifting through all the comments. Maybe you all should start using logsitall.com. Makes it easy to see how you rate.

I am caught up and finally thought I would get to rest on a rest day. Not gonna happen. SWAT team is doing a new (and supposedly harder) fitness qualifying test tomorrow. No rest for the weary!

Oops, forgot to give a shout out to Pat. He did that workout at One World. Seeing it first hand was friggin' awesome. He didn't even want to workout, and he still crushed it. Supposedly, that is the fastest documented Christine time, right Tony? Pat is a stud and a cool mofo to boot!

does CrossFit have an affiliate in Second Life?

wfs link here: http://secondlife.com/

from the article:

"For study purposes, curvy women were defined as those whose waists are smaller than their hips."

so it appears that one can be curvy without being fat/voluptuous.

Interesting

Freddy C-

Funny, Ken mentioned logsitall to me the other day and I got the link from George today. I'm just logged a couple of workouts, and hope to use it moving forward.

Jolie did great on Elizabeth, I need to up the weight on cleans next time...

3 x Full Clean and Jerk @ 135#
3 x Muscle-ups
10 rounds

Forgot to start clock.

Waist to Hip ratio is an important indicator of health in both genders.

When this article says curvy, they don't mean slightly fat, they are using it in a literal way.

Regardless of research says, I like light women with low body fat.

YMMV.

Hey cats and kittens but more realistic lions and lionesses.

I have a query about the handstand. I have been chatting up gymnasts and yoga instructors about proper transition into the handstand and proper handstand maintenance.

but then I thought, crossfitter's are all about handstands. So people, hook me up.

Right now I am doing my handstand push-ups against a wall. but I have been working on my transitions from a "teddy bear" position and just powering up into a full handstand(max time in handstand 5 seconds)

A challenge to all One Worlders:

On the end of that video it said: "the time to beat 8:22" let's keep the record in our house and beat that time.

This has probably been brought up a ton.... but where do they find this music ?

They are always good mixes, and ... I WANT THEM ALL ! and then some.

comment 16- AllisonNYC- ask Keith about Paleo-that is what he started me on bc I found all the measuring with the zone too much of a pain in light of having to also worry about feeding three kids with different food allergies to boot so I never stuck long on the plan. Paleo is easy :The preferred food groups are meat & fish, vegetables, nuts and seeds (pumpkin, sunflower). Some fruit, little starch, no sugar.
Basically if you cut out all the grains: bread, pasta, rice, corn and beans, then you'll start to lean out. If you measure your food and eat 14g of protein, 18g of carbs and 6g of fat at every meal and snack, then you'll start to see what a portion looks like. (zone)
Avoid sugar. He said dairy in moderation is ok too.
This seemed pretty easy and didnt involve all sorts of blocks/measuring. I now Xuan Mai did Paleo and had huge success with it ( as opposed to the zone). Sarena also does paleo). So it may be worth looking into as well. I followed it for 24 hours and have not been hungry either.

The implication for this study is not to be fat, but to eat paleo. High glycemic foods and the like that spike insulin are preferentially stored as abdominal (upper body) body fat. Eating lower insulin releasing diets has the opposite effect, burning fat preferentially from the visceral abdominal region. Look up some studies on very low calorie high-fat ketogenic diets, they lose a tad more weight than isocaloric high-carb VLC (very-low calorie) diets, but alot of the fat lost is from the abdomen in teh ketogenic diets.

Lovin the Queen jpratt

And I loovvvvvve my girl friend

just one comment on the diet issue, particularly paleo diet. It seems counter-intuitive to me to duplicate the diet practised in a time when most people lived to about 30 or 35 years of age. they ate what they had. just a thought.

#50

Life expectancy says very little about nutrition. If you have a family of 4 , the parents both live until 70 and the children die at birth. The average life span of those four people is 35. Fairly misleading.

If your research the paleo era you will find compelling evidence that nutrition was not a factor in low life expectancy, but rather it produced lean, healthy humans free of many of the modern era health problems.

George, #44.

Go to the Exercises and Demos section. Go to Gymnastics. Look up some of Roger's videos. There are several relating to handstands. As far as "transition into the handstand", the best way to "kick into a handstand" is to start from a proper lunge. Your front leg should be bent with hips facing forward. The knee should be bent so that you can barely not see your front toe. Your arms should be straight and there should be no "shoulder angle", that is there should be a straight line from you're hands all the way down through you're torso to your back leg. A common mistake is to drop the arms too early and break your shoulder angle as you reach for the ground. Make sure that everything is "tight", that is flex all of the muscles in your body so that you stay rigid, especially your gluts and abs. Push tall through your shoulders and don't stick your head out, ergo, keep it between your arms but you can look at the ground from the top of your periferal vision. If you want to ask me more specifically what you want help in, go ahead and post again or e-mail me. By the way, what do you mean by a "teddy bear" position?

Another invaluable reference for gymnastics stuff is www.DrillsandSkills.com. That's Roger's gymnastics reference website, there's a link from the Crossfit home page under "friends of CrossFit". Another easy way to easily access the videos (and you can urrrhhhmm.. check out our affiliate website- ;) is by going to www.CrossFitMarin.com)

If you want to work your freestanding handstand, a great way is to do it against the wall FACING THE WALL. You need to feel comfortable rolling out of a handstand first, so you don't get hurt if you collapse. For this drill, you try to walk your hands in as close to the wall as you can. If you stay in a proper "hollow" position, the only part of your body touching the wall should be your pointed toes. Your hands should be very close to the wall, maybe 3 inches away or less. If your hips are touching the wall, then you are arched and won't be able to get your hands in close. Once you feel pretty confident, tap the wall away slightly with your toes. If you fall forward, roll out, and if you go back into the wall, then tap the wall again and try to catch the handstand. One of the gymnastics videos on the exercises and demos section relates to rolling out of a handstand. Thanks, this just gave me an idea for another handstand video that we should make.

Hey, Pat, before downloading the video, I was debating as to whether or not to file it under my "fire-breather" wod folder or to put it in the normal "wod" folder. I ended up saving it to the "named girls" folder because it's Christine, but next time I download one of your workouts, I will definately know to save it in the "fire-breather" wod folder. You were really smokin'.

Nadia, Freddy, others,.. you guys might want to also check out www.athleticslog.com. It's also custom made for CrossFit workouts and it has hundreds of other saved workouts too. There are some fancy technical features that are very useful for CrossFiting and for running classes.

Played catch up today and improved my one rep max for pull ups by 5kg. 20kg, 25kg 30kg 35kg 37kg and 40kg. Going to go heavier earlier next time. And pull ups felt so easy afterwards. Going into work later and will use our new rings for more muscle up practice, any ideas on how to improve my muscle up stamina, maybe add resistance with some weight?

#54
Hi Colin, best thing you can do for stamina in muscle ups is more muscle ups-practicing mine tonight-musn't forget the chalk. Good meeting you and Steve at Beckton-Go Crossfit Catford!

HEY TROY

I got a video yesterday of me doing a few muscle ups in a row on the HOMEADE GHETTO RINGS! Check it out...

myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=22869947

#44 George

Here is a video that I posted a few weeks ago about doing a kipping HSPU, but I kick up into a handstand and it might be just another useful visual to go along with Amadraeus's great explaination. Hope this helps too.

myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=21931649

I have not had a chance to read the article or watch the video yet posted today, but will shortly....

~J~

~Train Hard and Push Through "IT"!~

ps- anyone who wants to add any constructive critisism to that muscle - up video I posted on #56, it would be greatly appreciated!

THANKS!

~J~

I have two very bright children.

The study authors seem to overlook the obvious fact that women with fatty hips AND waist suffer no shortage of fat resources. This sounds like a correlation - causation issue.

And it's pretty easy to come up with more plausible explanations why men are attracted to low waist/hip ratio in women.

got to laugh at America & shake my head in disbelief & disgust.

We really take the cake (oh yes, the pun has begun) when it comes to our lame ass excuses to be fat, Fat, FAT, and gettin' PHATer!

Now, big ol' galz are supposed to be better breeders. The media's reporting on a study that's supposed to brainwash us into wanting to mate with fatties.

I just puked up a zone block.

Look at us. Just look and weep.

Walk down any street, except one in San Diego or LA & count the fatties you see in 60 seconds. When I was a kid (oh, and yes, I did grow up in LA), fat people were so unusual that you did a double take when you saw one.

Go waaay back in cinematic history. Watch "Deliverance". No seriously, stay with me here. The Ned Beatty character is, by the standards of the 1970's, a really fat & weak guy. Judged by the standards of 2007, he looks absolutley normal.

Now, we have a study that's supposed to confirm what big heavy American women only wish was true: a fat ass makes you more desirable. I'm laughing my guts out, and it's still not even daylight outside.

I can only imagine the girth of the "scientists" who conducted this study. They must be huge, and looking to create some sort of leverage for scoring with the opposite sex. "Hey, baby, this isn't fat on my keister, it's essential omega 3 fatty acids, and studies confirm it makes me one hotT item. So, can I get your number?"

It sickens me to see big women. Yes, I am judgmental about this, but then again, if a person can't control what they put into their mouth, they really are weak and it's hard to imagine anything they actually can control about themselves. Look at fashion right now. Those huge pillowy billowy flowing maternity tops that are supposed to be the fashion are nothing of the kind... They're just a moneymaking nod to the fact that there's a whole lot of huge galz out there who need Omar the Tent Maker to get dressed. Fat is dictating American fashion. Vogue for the bovine.

It's not hot. It isn't desirable. It ain't a healthy breeding supply of omega three's stored in that caboose.

And, "studies" that confirm stuff like alcohol is good for you, carbs are good for you, hard work makes you sick, discipline is bad for your kids... you name it-they got it... some pseudo-scientific group will conduct a study to confirm the ludicrous, the utterly insane, if you just fund their study...

Well, I'm onto you, Mr. Labcoat.

And, this is just my caffeine fueled rant about a big caboose with junk in the trunk. I am equally as disgusted about big jugs. Sickening. Saggy. Useless. Infantile. No real athletes have the upper body of a dairy cow. Unkempt. Excess. The lower the body fat, the less the juggies. The bigger the balloons, the higher the body fat. Guys with moobies freak me out even more than fat chested women.

Unless the girl did a cut & paste job. I have no idea why some like the Pam Anderson look, and will bleed themselves or their girlfriends to get it. But at least that isn't fat coagulating on a woman's chest. It's silicone encapsulated in breast tissue, and though it looks preposterously like a Christmas turkey with all da stuffin', at least it ain't a big pile of yellowy, lumpy fat. Oh, stop, I'm getting nauseated again.

And, I have never ever seen a woman with a six pack of racked & stacked abs (which you just can't get surgically, by barfing or not eating, or through any other way than honestly earning them) and a big set of milkies hanging over them. Nature doesn't work like that. Either she's strong and fit, or she's fat & has a big caboose & bOObs.

It's pretty disappointing that the media & science are working around the clock to force feed America the disinformation that fat chicks are hotT & should be desired above something that is strong, fit, tight, athletic, chisled, efficient & looks like a CrossFit hottie. A vision of Annie pops into mind. Now, that's a woman. Ditto Nicole. The Eva.

Next thing you know, there will be a study declaring that racked & stacked hot guys like Greg Amundson aren't really as hotT as big weak beer bellied erectile disfunctioned lazyboy inhabitants like John Goodman. Likely, it will be sponsored by some non-profit group named "Obese Americans Fighting for Access to Some Sex" or "OAF ASS".

I'm not buying it. I'm not pursuaded. I'm going to keep my abs, my high & tight hiney, my countable ribs, and just do what Coach says. If that makes me less of a breeder, then that's just a happy added bonus.

Thus endith the rant for the day.

Semper CrossFit.

Hips or no hips.

All I ever wanted in a woman was someone who appreciated my softer side...

"What is best in life?"

"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women." -Conan

What is going on around here? Why all these rest day articles about fitness and such? I don't come here on rest days to hear dribble about fitness.

;)

19 / F
Did a nice KB workout...I rested yesterday - and over thanksgiving did some nice hiking...good times.

Loved the funky remix. Sly and the family of stone = Uber cool!!

Good effort Pat!

Where do all these good music tracks come from??

yesterdays pullups...
25kg,45kg,50kg,56kg,57.5kg,69kg(f),68.5kg(f)

57.5 (126.5lbs) is a new PR.

#39

No secondlife affiliate that I know of - I don't think the CF community is big on online communities other than the msg boards and this linear set of comments.

I tried starting up #crossfit IRC channel on freenode.net and I think a total of 2 people over the last year showed up.

How about you start one on secondlife?

Well, I can't compete with most of the people here, but I made a new personal best with this workout.
31/m/13 Stone

+20
+25
+30
+35 -failed
+35 -switched grip
+40
+45

I made it to 13 Stone (approx 182 lbs) +45 added weight!

Wooooooooooot!

Where DO all these great mixes come from and how can I download them??

~J~

I tried Nancy for the first time. I thought I would be all hardcore and try it as prescribed. I did two sets of 95 and nearly died. I had to go down to 85 for the final three and I think I did die. By the way my legs are feeling right now, I think I am at least having an out of body experience. Anyway I finished in 31:16.

Had to try "Christine" after seeing Pat do such an outstanding job!

31/M/168
Did 185 lbs on Deadlifts
Everything else as Rx'd
Time: 10:00 minutes even

1st time poster, 1.5 year cross-fitter:

Any suggestions on how to get started on the zone diet?
Any reading material that might help me out, or maybe a list of simple on-the-go zone diet friendly foods, besided just the bars?
Thanks!
-E

Allison: The Zone will help you preserve/gain muscle while losing fat. Keep it up, and you will get amazing, sustainable, repeatable results. Generally speaking, I think the Zone is pretty paleo if you do it right - lean protein, veggies, no breads/starchy foods, some fruits, nuts, no sugar. Just make sure your proportions are right so that you stay in the Zone. Oh, and your coach is right - everything is so much easier sans body fat. Of course, that just means you get to push harder. Here's one to try: don't just imagine carrying the weight around during your workout, do it. SpideyChk had me run as fast and as hard as I could carrying a weighted pack for 1/10 mile followed by squats, then add weight and repeat until you can't go anymore. Take off the bag. You will feel light as a feather, like a child bounding about with ease and joy. Cheers!

Morning!

Since this is a rest day, I thought I'd post this today. I'm looking for some gymnastics rings that I can take down to the gym here at work to do ring dips, etc. Does anyone know of a company that sells rings that have snap hooks on them so that they can easily be connected and disconnected to the top crossbar of a weightlifting cage/rack?

Thanks all!

I knew my kids were smart for some unknown reason!

Rememember, the Zone is a perfect balance of insulin/ glycogen levels, and it really allows you to tweak the fat for energy as you get into wanting more performance. By measuring you are adjusting your body to its peak.( perfect form).

#71 Brian

Why not just use rings, homeade or bought, and use lashing straps to put them up. I bought 14ft lashing straps from home depot, they are 400lb test each, and I hang my rings off the center bar or the smith machine (want to throw that machine out the flippin window) and hang my rings from the tree in the backyard.
Just my two cents from my experience.

~J~

~Train Hard and Push Through "IT"!~

I've got access to the full article thru my school. If anyone wants to read it shoot me an e-mail and I can send it to you.

It's interesting, however a full two pages of the article covers research done on HWR and it's correlation to attractiveness. I'm not sure that helps the case of "smarter" children and women or what purpose it actually serves the authors' points.

Anyone have a suggestion for elbow pain during pullups. I have tried ring pullups and several variants. Since many of the WODs have pullups in them I don't want to avoid them. I have done pull downs but it is not them same.

Waist-to-hip ratio is falling out of favor as a measure of central adiposity. The researchers should have used a different measure.

#70 Evan: see comment #85 on 11/23. That'll get you started.

Curvy women! Finally some well deserved recognition to those women who are strong, athletic, curvy, not overweight and not stick thin...
Great job Pat! Kick ass workout!

Spiderchick, OAF ASS? Love it, great rant. You forgot to mention how those of us who make concerted effort to not be obese are often regarded as fanatical, fitness/health/diet nazis. A staggering amount of anger and emotion can be aimed in your direction when you are fit and your relative/friend/coworker/neighbor/etc. is not. That's enough, or way too much. Happy rest day all.

CCTJOEY, Nicely said, one of my favorite quotes. I don't understand why people look at me funny everytime I say that...Semper Fi

Pat, awesome workout brother. Watch your ERG technique. Your drive is good but your recovery should have your hands passing your knees before you start bringing your legs back up. Recovery goes: arms out, swing back forward, then bring legs up to catch position. reverse on the drive.

Couple questions...

At what age was WHR measured in the women in the study? i.e. if a woman at 20 y.o. has a low WHR and has a child, but by the time she is 40 she has a high WHR, did they count her WHR at 40 or at 20?. Seems like they would need to measure WHR pre-conception to claim that the right kind of fat store produces smarter offspring.

Couldn't a healthy diet + exercise = low WHR and healthy diet + exercise = longer life and higher intelligence? Seems like WHR isn't necessrily causative.

There was something that caught my eye in that photo with Allison the other day.

I knew I had seen Joey in a compromising position before! If you're the Joey I suspect you are, I've got a fantastic snapshot of you wearing a cardboard hat and playing with an OC gun! Anybody need to bribe Joey??

Good to see you're still having fun!

41yo/f
swam 2200 20:38

Damn Spider-chick! I'm glad you said it. Otherwise, it would have come from me, and I don't know how many women out there would give me a hard time for seeing the ever-expanding population as a bad thing. Yes, it's sexy to be feminine, but it's even better to be fit and healthy. The CrossFit women are hot (ditto about Annie).

Of course, the study doesn't go all out Sir Mix-A-Lot. It's only based on waist2hip ratios, so a small waist and genetically larger hips (think Marilyn Monroe) look curvy and attractive to men. It's not like the study pushes the idea that chub is in, just that curves look and may actually be good for breeding.

Still, I can't help having to push my eyes back into their sockets after AllisonNYC's latest photo. I'm a "breeder" (a heterosexual man, as the song goes). I think there's a certain level, that most of the celeb photos which acompanied the article showed, where a woman can be curvacious, fit, and healthy (and very attractive). The problem is that so many women out there are not the latter 2 (and sometimes none of the 3), and expect that, somehow, it's still okay because they're women and that I'm a pig for thinking so. That IS nasty.

In summary,
Curves = good to have in the right places
Fit = hot

Sorry, I have to go put on my labcoat and check my reaction;)

On rest days- I almost enjoy reading the comments more than the actual article.

I don't think the article was saying that it's OK to be fat- although I really enjoyed your rant Spider chick and really agree with all you say. I grew up in SoCal and now I live in New England where people are twice the size of people back home- It makes me sad. My in-laws (except for my husband who does CrossFit and Zone) are all overweight and think my figure is based on genetics- not hard work, but enough about that.

I think the article was just stating what we already know- carrying weight around your midsection is more dangerous than carrying weight around your thighs. Back when I was 175lbs. I had no waist- now- 30lbs. later (I'm 5'8") I do. My WHR has gone down and that is better. I don't need an article to tell me this though- I just need to look in the mirror and think about how much better I feel now.

Allison- Paleo is good, Zone is better. Have you seen all of Coach's nutrition lectures on the Journal?? Those help keep me motivated. I've been on the Zone for a few weeks now and I feel a difference when I'm not on it. It's well worth it, leads to better training and just more productivity in life in general. Good luck!

Couldn't rest today - too much rest over Thanksgiving.

My 3rd week of Crossfit:

3X
400 m run
21 kettlebell swings (8 lbs)
15 pull-ups (assisted)

Time: 24.5 mins

Damn Spider Chick! I LOVE that you can express yourself so well....but I really don't think anyone is suggesting that fatter is better. I have a big ass...but I also have a six pack. 16 years of soccer left me with a bubble butt and hard work helps me keep my stomach looking good. In fact, my WOD at One World is called "abs n' ass"....I agree with you on many levels....we really shouldn't be suggesting to the public that fat is acceptable, but hey....I respect the Hell out of women that own their bodies. To each their own.

Seriously though....you should really consider writing articles! Impressive.

I didn't read all the comments up to this point, I'll add that at first, and I likely won't return to read those made later.

Note that the study talked about Waist-to-Hip RATIO (WHR), NOT percent of bodyfat (BF%). Even the study authors didn't seem to understand that when they wrote the title. Note that no part of the study other than the commentary parts (not the research parts) implied any studying going on regarding BF%, only WHR.

Take Nicole, Eva, SpiderChick, and any of the other CF ubergirls you want and measure their WHR. I'll bet it is "low", as in "desirable". Thick waists, whether on someone with low or high bodyfat, are not attractive on anyone, men or women, and a thick waist is typically indicative of hormonal imbalances that are causing those fat deposition patterns. The waist always tapers in to some extent on healthy, attractive individuals, which makes it smaller than the hips, which then makes for a "low" WHR.

This is not a fluke study. There is quite a bit of research on WHR, feel free to look it up. THEY ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT BODYFAT %.

No more need to rant, low BF% women!

Measure your WHR before accusing the researchers of trying to prove anything--you'll likely find that strong, lean, healthy women fall exactly within the "desired" range the researchers found.

Also, shouldn't the Paleo/Zone discussions be sent to the message board or even better, to the "search" function on the message board? All of the questions being raised have been dealt with there tens, if not hundreds, of times before.

QUESTION:
Does anyone know if you have to sub regular pull-ups and dips for MU's can you scale it down in number if you add weight???? Is there a ratio for that?
Or am I just a moron and am missing something here?? Please be gentle I am in my first month with CF.

Hey, thought I could weigh in on the paleo discussion. I have been eating paleo for almost two years, and I have never looked back. It is the only thing I do that gets me more weird looks and questions than CF. It is an attempt to reproduce the kind of diet people were eating for the majority of human evolution - basically fish, lean meat, vegetables, fruit, nuts and healthy oils. No grains (bread, pasta, rice, corn), legumes (peas, beans, peanuts), starchy vegetables (potatoes), dairy, sugar or salt.

It was not easy to convince a friend, who is a dietitian and thinks that government recommendations are the way to go, that cutting two food groups completely out of my diet could be healthy in any way. I showed her my lipid profile after a medical, and she isn't so sure anymore. I had the lowest triglycerides she had seen. I was sleeping better, training harder, and feeling the best I ever had in my life.

Now that I am eating in a mess hall, it is a bit more difficult to follow. I decided, based on all the crossfit believers, to try a zone-type diet instead. I must admit that I haven't found as much success with it. Maybe I need to be more precise with measurements and calculations, or maybe I just prefer to eat whenever I feel like it (as long as it is all good food!). I found I was just going back to foods I hadn't been eating for two years because they were "zone-friendly," and I didn't like that at all. There are many people who post regularly on the crossfit message board who prefer a zone-type diet composed of paleo foods. Check out the boards for tons of info. As for me, I'm sticking with paleo.

Anyway, point is, I would recommend anyone try a paleo diet. I went cold turkey (hehe) on the milk, cheese, bread, pasta and everything, and I am sure anyone else can too. No measuring involved, just eat when you are hungry. The only non-paleo things I have now are pizza and beer on Fridays. I am sure the hunter-gatherers I am trying to emulate wouldn't mind that at all.

#50 Struvey

Also on the life expectency issue. I remember reading somewhere that life expectency for a Roman(highly civilized grain-eating) was about the same as for paleo folks(i.e. diet was not the factor). The big change in life expectency came with treatments for infections/diseases.

There are a LOT of scary smart people here when it comes to diet, and I'm not one of them but if you start researching Zone/Paleo you can find some pretty interesting stuff.

If a woman is a bit on the fatter side, but with a nice hourglass shape, AND she can run a 400 under 2 min, do a few pull ups and push ups, and carry all her smart and healthy babies around at the same time, I think she is a picture of health.

Okay, Okay, I've looked up Zone after all of you are swearing by it, and it looks complicated. Too much counting. But, my diet does need adjusting. Are you guys learning from a book or are you consulting with the Zone folks or what? How do you create your diets, plan your meals, etc. With no breakfast, no access to healthy restaurants in my area for lunch, and I'm lucky if I get a decent dinner, how do you all do this?

Breakfast:
Raisin Bran and a Coke

lunch: Quiznos sub with salad

Dinner: ?? Usually cereal again or boiled chicken.

I'm interested in seeing what I can really accomplish on a great diet. My strength is there, as I am no slouch. M/31/190. My workout last night:
7x1
Body weight snatches
pullups + 150#
followed by
21-15-9
135# cleans
ring dips
4 min.

Anyway, feel free to email me with any tips on how the hell to follow those diets.

Pat,

Very nice workout. The only thing I would say is that coming from a rowing background, you might be able to knock a little more time off your 500s with a little better erg technique. I would just suggest these two things:

1. Quicker hands out of the finish, or end of the stroke. You're making more work for yourself having to use your shoulders to lift the handle over your knees. Think of your shoulder blades being pulled toward the start of the stroke by your hands (which they can't do until your arms are fully extended). Hold down those knees until the handle is over and your in the position you'll start the stroke from, then slide forward to the catch (start) and fire those legs. As an added bonus, quicker hands is a free way to accomplish a higher stroke rating without expending any more energy.

2. When you first start your 500, get the wheel up to speed quickly. The best way to do this is to have a start sequence that works for you. I would suggest starting only using a 1/2 slide drive (the back half) and sitting straight up. Over the course of the first few strokes, gradually lengthen the slide to full length and introduce some swing from your hips.

Just my 2¢

Spiderchick: Not that I agree with the article in any way, because, let's face it, we can find tests, studies, articles, scientific literature, you name it, for well, you name it. But the article isn't talking about obese people, or even overweight people. The way I read it, the article simply talks about the idea that a larger difference between your waist circumference and your hip circumference may be indicative of better health. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it seems to me that bigger girls (the ones Buffalo Bill might go for) don't have a big difference between their hips and waist. They're straight up and straight down. I don't think the article is talking about the women you reference. Now, will the mass media and general, uninquisitive public latch onto the article as an excuse to pour vats of cavatelli into their gaping maws? All while resting on their couches to reduce stress with a jug of cheap red wine by their side (because it's good for the heart, you know)? Probably. So, I'm with you on that one. That said, lay off on the boobs. I'll keep mine, thank you very much. And my hips, just a smaller version of them. FYI, intend to pay a visit to the SWSR tonight. I'll let you know how it goes. Jeez, I miss your rants, even if I don't always agree with them.

spider chick-

eventhough I am not sure that is what the article was getting at, i really enjoyed your rant, and I definitely hear what you are saying. It seems like people will look for ANY reason to justify that being overweight is ok. either that or they are looking for a quick fix to lose weight.
It's funny i emailed my clients the Lauren Parker success story video that was posted recently, and 2 out of 4 cancelled their training appt that day...coincidence? ;-) hard work=fear for some.

p.s. this line was effin classic.

"Hey, baby, this isn't fat on my keister, it's essential omega 3 fatty acids, and studies confirm it makes me one hotT item. So, can I get your number?"

Hey SpiderChick, most of us guys like fit girls with ample breasts and low waist to hip ratios. And yes that is possible, just check out AllisonNYC.

You know, I in one of the artciles it said "hour glass shaped versus apple shaped" women. SAying hour glassed shaped women, or curvy women, live longer and have smarter kids, where apple shaped women, or those with a lower WHR do not.

I know that it also makes references to linear shaped or thinner women. Linear shaped though does not describe fit or unfit, nor does curvy describe fit or unfit.

I have seen women who have a "curvy" as described in these articles, figure and are animals in WOD's. Gorgeous and sexy women they are though, fit and healthy (my bride for one of many examples). I have seen women of "Linear shape", as described in the articles, who are also maniacs in WOD's, and they too are beautiful, attractive and sexy, strong, fit and healthy women (take SPIDER CHICK for one of many examples.
Conversely, I have seen those in both "shapes, linear and curvy, in horrfying physical, mental and spiritual health.
The articles are talking about some things that are just common sense. There are higher omega 3 fatty acids in those figures that are curvy. It doesn't say that those women that are curvy are mcdonald cheeseburger eating fat a$$e$.
I am kind of confused at the debate here, but as always, I enjoy the banter!

~J~

~Train Hard and Push Through "IT"!~

You know, I in one of the artciles it said "hour glass shaped versus apple shaped" women. SAying hour glassed shaped women, or curvy women, live longer and have smarter kids, where apple shaped women, or those with a lower WHR do not.

I know that it also makes references to linear shaped or thinner women. Linear shaped though does not describe fit or unfit, nor does curvy describe fit or unfit.

I have seen women who have a "curvy" as described in these articles, figure and are animals in WOD's. Gorgeous and $exy women they are though, fit and healthy (my bride for one of many examples). I have seen women of "Linear shape", as described in the articles, who are also maniacs in WOD's, and they too are beautiful, attractive and $exy, strong, fit and healthy women (take SPIDER CHICK for one of many examples.
Conversely, I have seen those in both "shapes, linear and curvy, in horrfying physical, mental and spiritual health.
The articles are talking about some things that are just common sense. There are higher omega 3 fatty acids in those figures that are curvy. It doesn't say that those women that are curvy are mcdonald cheeseburger eating fat a$$-es.
I am kind of confused at the debate here, but as always, I enjoy the banter!

~J~

~Train Hard and Push Through "IT"!~

Nice Nadia!
Let me know how that works...

Hey guys, I don't think the study was advocating being fat. They're saying if you are a woman who has the body type that primarily deposits fat in the hips and breasts your kids will be smarter, etc. That is, if you gain a few pounds and it all goes to your hips and boobs, your kids are more likely to be smart and whatnot than if that fat goes straight to your belly.

Seems to be more evidence that belly fat should be most dreaded, given that the "apple" belly-fat depositing shape is also connected to a higher risk of heart disease and other afflictions.

Thanks to everyone pointing out that the articles and study are NOT supporting the idea that it is okay to be fat!! (Can we have some rational reaction/discussion, please?!)

Someone could be fairly thin and still have a low WHR. Equally, someone could be quite heavy and have a high WHR. I didn't understand the study to say that there is necessarily a causative relationship between WHR and brains/longevity - rather I understood it to say that there seems to be a correlative relationship. These are not the same thing!

I'm a little surprised by how hot this article has made a couple of people (it seems to be getting more female than male knickers in a knot). Geeesshh! If you're going to get pissy about something, please make sure that it's for a reason. I think a lot of energy was wasted on ranting this a.m. I'm pretty sure that many Cross Fit Hotties have a pretty low WHR.

I think stick thin men/women are just as unattractive as fat ones. Both need to work out - and more for the health benefits than for the looks.

BTW - I thought that Cross Fit was for forging elite fitness - not elitist fitness, right?!

spider chick

unless i TOTALLY missed the point of the article, i don't think it is a rationalization for being fat at all. it is saying that a hip to waist ratio of between .60 and .70 looks great and apparently has other benefits as well.

if a woman is fat in her waist (i.e. FAT), then her hip to waist ratio goes up way over .70. take a waist of 24 and hips 36 and it comes out to .66. try it with your own measurements and bet you are somewhere around .60 which is fantastic.

still a well written rant though. as usual. did i miss something here?? :)

I am reminded of Sara Silverman's racist line, "the best time to have children is when you're a black teenager."

SunnySide, Woodrow

Thanks for the technique comments on my rowing. I definitely could use any help you can give me. Ill do my best to put your comments into action next time i row.

Pat

To answer #24 Jeremy:
BCF, (that's before CF) there was always a 12" difference in my waist versus hip measurements, no matter how much I weighed. Now it is a constant 9". So my WHR has gone up, but it is still in the desired range. Previously as low as .68 and now it's at .74. That's not really that much of a difference in WHR, even though I weigh 25lbs less and have substantially less body fat. I just carry my weight in the lower half of my body.

So spider chick, though I love your rant, it is not applicable to the current study. I am sure your WHR would be in the desired range as well. Check it out and see.

Spiderchick - Great to read one of your rants again. Excellent!

CCTJOEY - I agree wholeheartedly. Fitness on rest day is boring.

Who knows this song?

Big bottom
Big bottom
Talk about mud flaps my gal's got 'em
Big bottom
Drive me out of my mind
How could I leave this behind?

I am not one to normally post on crossfit. I do the workouts, track my progress, and go quietly about my way. However, I felt compelled to comment on this one. I, like another individual that posted, have a bubble butt only it is from years of competitive gymnastics and from a family of bubble-butted people (not sure if that is the technical term for it or not, but I will use it here). For a really long time I would have killed to be one of the bean pole straight skinny women; but even at my most trim I will still rock a set of 39in hips, (that is visibly seeing hipbone), and a 28in waist with visible abs and ribs. Does that make me fat? No, because I know that it is rock solid and I am healthy. I rock my curves and have learned that even having "a little junk in the trunk" is okay. Granted I agree with some of the rants that excessive amounts of fat and the desire to latch on to anything to allow that excess fat is absurd and a travesty of our society, however, having curves (ie: hips, rear, and breasts) does not make a person fat or overweight. A lot of times that just comes down to genetics. I know a number of women with rock hard abs and big breasts that are all natural, that is just how they are built and there is nothing wrong with that. I think it was stated perfectly earlier that all women should rock the body that they are given and become as healthy as they can in that body.

#96-Paul
For an easy Zone read, try this. It makes it a lot easier in fewer words than the Zone books by Dr. Sears. His books are great but can be a long read.

http://www.crossfit.com/journal/library/cfissue21_May04.pdf

Also, for breeding issues, if you've ever breast fed a baby, you'll begin to appreciate the extra fat that gets stored around the hips. It tends to go away for that reason, if you take care of yourself. Curves, not fat, are a good thing. Even when I get to my lowest healthy weight they are still there, for me it's due to bone structure. Right now it's also due to about 10 extra pounds that won't go away due to insulin issues of a different sort. Unlike most people, I get to inject mine on a daily basis. Zone and Crossfit have cut that amount in half!
And yes, my two children are geniuses!

Spider Chick-Spot on Sister. Check out CrossFit Fredericksburg next summer. Will try and get it up and running between now and March 08 when my contract is up here in Iraq.

~Work out or Move Out~

the value in this study is that it is taking account of the "waist to hip ratio" as an indicator of further health and, in this case, cognitive benefits. what is the nature of this connection (causal, incidental) is still left a little muddy.

i was told a couple of years ago by my doctor that the waist to hip ratio is the most reliable indicator for future heart issues in men, a near consistent correlation. the logic being that bigger hips in men indicate a stronger more muscular physique, while the waist size reflected the nature of their diet (as well as genetic predisposition to a pear or apple shaped body.) all these things apply equally to the man as well as woman. though in men, i think we just called them "well built". the use of the word "Curvy" is rather unfortunate methinks...

m/56/70"/204

Spider chick too funny. I do take exception to the idea that a couple of drinks are unhealthy :)

Seriously though, since the fetus uptakes from the mothers dietary intake, wouldn't supplementing omega 3's during pregnancy be a better choice? Problem with fat cells is once you have them, they don't go away without liposuction. You may shrink them with exercise and diet, but they don't disappear. Better not to gain them in the first place. Unless you are planning for the next ice age.

Can anyone tell me why most of the affiliate gyms only have "classes" or "personal training", but don't seem to offer just a gym geared to crossfit that, like other gyms, you just come to when you want and workout? If I am wrong, and this is not the case let me know. I am possibly moving to the SF Bay area next month and was stoked because there are actually Crossfit gyms out there (unlike here in OK), but I don't like the idea of having to go at a certain time to participate in the class. If there are any affiliates near SF that subscribe to the aforementioned philosophy, someone please point me in the right direction.

did my chins-first one with a weight belt and strap hanging-spine made interesting noises.
loaded dumbbell and held between shins
10kg
15kg
20kg
25kg
30kg
35kg,
only weigh 70kg so not bad-chin up bar creaked like mad tho

You know, I get fitter and fitter but I'm only ADDING curves...my arms used to be straight, now I have some nice rounded biceps! LOL. My arse isn't going away anytime soon, nor do I want it to - I use it for squats, thank you very much!

Just starting to mix crossfit back in with my heavy training need the cardio. I live in North Jersey, Morris County. Just wondering if there are any active crossfitters local to me and when and where people are doing the group thing.
JLake

Did "Nancy" yesterday. Yea, I'm a few days off.

17:02 as rx'd. Funny, all the OHS were unbroken, but I didn't exactly crush it. Gotta pick that running game up!

Exactly; I don't think the article's advocating "fatness" at all, though that's the way it may be interpreted by the masses. (Remember the "chocolate" and the "wine" studies?) Overweight people tend to have little difference between their waists and their hips, or bigger waists than hips, which is unhealthy. I'm "curvy" by this article's standards, and quite fit. (.70 WHR; 11-inch difference between my waist and my hips) I'm sure all the Crossfit women, even those with low bodyfat who are much fitter than I am, have similar ratios. Fit women are healthy women.

Exactly; I don't think the article's advocating "fatness" at all, though that's the way it may be interpreted by the masses. (Remember the "chocolate" and the "wine" studies?) Overweight people tend to have little difference between their waists and their hips, or bigger waists than hips, which is unhealthy. I'm "curvy" by this article's standards, and quite fit. (.70 WHR; 11-inch difference between my waist and my hips) I'm sure all the Crossfit women, even those with low bodyfat who are much fitter than I am, have similar ratios. Fit women are healthy women.

A quick question to every one that can advise:
i have been doing crossfit for one month now, i wanted to see how it could benifit me so i have trained really hard beating the bench mark workouts 2nd time round. I have dropped 3% bf, and all of this has been achieved without changing my food intake. my diet is very healthy but i dont feel it is as strict as the zone. It seems to be the thing to do if your serious about reaching goals. do you think i would of got better results doing it from the begining?

This may make me incredibly unpopular in cf, but here goes. To the spiderchick rant:
I want to cry. I even am. I don't know you and you don't know me and you did not direct comments to me, but I fit.
Last March, my weight was 230 pounds and what I was putting into my mouth was unhealthy. Lack of Self control? Probably, but obesity is so very, very much more than self control.
I'm now at 185-189 and have been at cf since the end of September. I tried two years ago but was just too heavy to sustain the workouts. So I worked out some health issues and worked hard last spring and summer to begin a transformation.
Self control? I have some, I'd like to think I have a little more with each fran, elizabeth, and each time I get closer to that kipping pull up. But I'm still a "fattie." doG, I hate that word. It hurts. Next week I'll be a little better than today. And if I hit my goals by March, I'll be rock star.
But I'll NEVER look like an Eva, or an Annie, or Nichole. My body just isn't put together that way and I'm okay with it. I'll be the best I can be but the bod may still not look good enough to walk in L.A. in shorts and a sports bra.

I respect your right to your rants, just please know obesity isn't as cut and dried as choice. It's emotional and painful and shameful and a tough mountain to climb.
Thanks for listening.
Juli
F/189/40 Not a shero, but trying to be better than yesterday

I wonder whether just maybe the fathers of these smart children are at least partially responsible for their children's cognitive abilities.

I have a theory: Women with strong bones have smarter children. I haven't done the research, but I'm betting that women with strong bones are healthier and therefore have a greater selection of men to choose from. Given the greater choice, they choose smarter mates.

I'm also working on a theory that if and when SpiderChick has children they will have ferocious verbal skills and will not be picked on at school.

Curvy doesn't mean fat or unfit. Fit comes in all shapes.

I've seen lots of examples of this by watching Crossfit videos. Crossfit women are strong and we have diferent body types. What's wrong with that? That's one of the greatest things I've learned from the Crossfit women who I look up to. It's important to showcase all sorts of fit women with all body types. no curves, big booty, big boobies, both, tall, short whatever. The key is being healthy and strong.

Lots of people are hung up on one body type being the right one. How about working hard, eating right, respecting your body and whatever it looks like is the way it's supposed to be.

I can't wait until I'm as strong as Spider Chick, Nicole, Eva, Annie and I look like it. Boobs, six pack and all!

I tried to find the article this was in so I could just post the link. No luck. So here is the article: (I think this is a great voice for women...)

"If I were feeling a little more lawless, I'd gather all the copies of cosmo and seventeen , douse them in karosene and strike the match. I'd throw in reams of print ads from clavin klien and watch with delight as Kate moss's stick thin image was reduced to carbon. I'd add copies of shape and Runner's worold until the flames reached toward the heavens, and then I'd crank call the editorial desk at Muscle and Fitness until they stopped publishing pictures of women on steroids.

I'd get the master tapes of America's next top model and dub over them with "Nasty grils", broadcasting the results on every television station in america. I'd skywrite "CROSSFIT.COM" across the Boston skyline and gently admonish hoards of long distance runners trotting along the Charles river-with a bullhorn.

I'd take every women with mass media induced ideals of beauty and I'd show them what it really means to be beautiful.

Beautiful women are strong and powerful. They are athletes, capable of every feat under the sun. They have muscles, borne or hard work and sweat. They gauge their self worth though accomplishments, not by the numbers on the bathroom scale. They understand that muscle weighs more than fat, AND THEY LOVE THE FACT THAT DESIGNER JEANS DON'T FIT OVER THEIR WELL DEVOLPED QUADS.

They know that high repetition using light weights is a path to mediocrity, and "toning" is a cokplete and utter myth. They refuse to succomb to the marketers that prey on insecurity, leaving the pre-packaged diet dinners and fat burning pills on the shelf to pass their expiration date.

Beautiful women train with intensity. They derive self image from the quality of their work and their ability to excel, and they wouldn't be caught dead with a nugnyl pink dumbell. They move iron, they do pullups, they jump, sprint, punch, and kick, and they use the elicptical machine as a place to hang their jump rope.

They spent their weekends in sport, climbing walls, winning races, and running rivers. They lasugh as they sprint circles around the unschooled, turning the image obsessed into bench warmers. Beautiful women don't care if they're soaked in sweat and covered in dirt, if their nails are chipped or their hair out of place. THEY CARE ONLY ABOUT THE QULITY OF LIFE.

Beautiful women are happy, healthy, and strong, they're right there beside me, tossing conventional beauty on the ever growing flames of what used to be.

Be BEAUTIFUL!"

I don't know if any of that pertains to the debate, but i alot of my clients really aprriciated the article, so I thought I'd post it here!

~J~

~Train Hard and Push Through "IT"!~

I feel the same way Allison. :) I'm looking forward to doing more than two unassisted pullups in a row, and enjoying the work it takes -- and the odd looks in my commerical gym -- to get there. I'm very inspired by the women I see in the videos and whose words I read.
Emily (30/5'4"/130)

Hey Juli- You're my shero for the day. Your hard work is inspiring. We all start out at different places but we're all working towards the same thing- the best we can be. Not the best someone else we can be.

Keep it up- your head and your hard work. And don't you cry.

#50 struvey

Humans lived no more than 40 years up until the industrial revolution. It wasn't until sewars, sanitation and medicine that we started to live longer. Circ 1900's. Check out www.arthurdevany.com He has a great post on this. The argument about them not living past 40 is not a valid one concerning Paleo.

One day after a grueling Crossfit workout in the park, Bob sat down under a tree with his friend Jeff to recover before going back to work in the office. Jeff had been watching Bob in utter amazement as he ate his greasy cheesesteak and fries. Together, enjoying the scenery, relaxing in the sun… Bob noticed a familiar young woman, appearing physically fit, gasping for air in the playground. Worried, he continued to watch her. Realizing she was another one of those addicted ‘hotties’, an avid crossfitter, signified by the amount of pull-ups, push-ups and burpees she was busting out, he was relieved and pointed her out to Jeff.
Bob and Jeff then did the typical guy thing “CHECK HER OUT” tight hips, tight waist, nice figure… and so on… oh and don’t forget her cognitive ability: concentration, memory, logical thinking, perception, intuition, reasoning, hand-eye-coordination…what a turn on…
The point is this… do men prefer women with a lower waist to hip ratio b/c they are shallow or is it b/c the woman is smarter therefore more confident?

The cognitive anthropologist attempts to represent the logical systems of thought of other people.
For example, WHY DO MEN LIKE WOMEN WITH A LOWER WHR? It can’t just be physical, so let’s put some sort of spin on it and claim it has something to do with her cognitive ability.
Did you ever actually read some of the peer reviewed journal articles that are published? What a joke. Reliability? Validity?

The final statement in the abstract… “These findings support the idea that WHR reflects the availability of neurodevelopmental resources and thus offer a new explanation for men's preference for low WHR.

Men like women with a smaller WHR b/c physically, they look better. No excuse needed. End of story. The abstract claims to control correlates for cognitive ability… how? We can make studies reveal whatever we want them to say.

here's a selling campaign I saw in NYC when I was there awhile ago: Reebok Run Easy.

http://www.goruneasy.com/RunEasy/

it was more of the same shameful stuff. big & fat is good if that's what you like, trying hard and sweating when you exercising is bad, and, if you buy my shoes & walk around in them at your leisurely pace, then you'll be fit and don't let anyone tell you different. buy my shoes.

sad disinformation that creates safe havens for people who are killing themselves with fat.

I read the whole of the 3 posted articles, and have been aware of the issue for quite some time. WHR is something I learned about in the 1990's. Frankly, when I dress, I have WHR in mind.

But, the media's treatment of the being-fat-is-good "studies" is really summed up in headline from the second link's NYT article: "The Wider Gal's Hips, the Higher Their IQ". That's going to cause a lot of damage.

The media & labcoat mafia are creating & reinforcing excuses and safe harbors for obsese people. It's a deadly practice of disiformation.

And, I have no love for the ultra skinny Paris Hilton genre. I'm even more virulent about those twits.

Muscular women are hot. And reproductively valuable. Emaciated or obese means sickly.

Imagine with me if you will, a world where the truth about fitness wasn't obfuscated by media, labcoats and the obesity industry. Where excuses were stripped away by sciece instead of reinforced. Where Madison Ave selling campaigns didn't kill us off by adding one pound at a time.

My hope for everyone is a state of superhealth that's well beyond a man-pleasin' WHR. I hope that everyone has a no kidding rock hard 6 pack, and a posterior chain so strong that they can crack walnuts in their cheeks. And that they live like that for 100 years.

A curvy body is really cute. And a high WHR is better than a lousy one. But, that's not all we can hope or settle for, though most don't understand that there's something greater the next level beyond that. Wouldn't it be splendid if the average American was in super health? Not just entry level okay. But, super hero fitness for all of us. If the Santa Cruz type crew was just everywhere?

That's just a hope, but it's what keeps me going to the gym.

Imagine if the media and the labcoats bombarded us with the truth: that everyone could be CrossFit and in superhealth if they just follow Coach's advice? What would those headlines be? Athletic and Firm People Tend to Be Happier & Live Longer Lives? Not a bad thing to promote, huh? Shame on studies that lead women to think, well, my kind of fat isn't so bad after all, so pass the twinkies. I remember learning about studies that promoted smoking. Then smoking with filters on the ends. Same stuff. Different disease.

J RoCk - If I'm not mistaken, that's not an article, that's a SpiderChick rest day rant.

U'i - You've lost 45 pounds since March and you claim not to be a shero? How much more can you lift now? How much higher can you jump? How much faster can you run? Shero status doesn't come from looks or the scale. It comes from the barbell, which you have the courage to come back and lift again and again and again. I think you fit the category of shero pretty well.

-JP

Well, I love my curves (or at least do now after 35 years of living with them)...and Crossfit only helps me to accentuate them-especially with the all the squats-front,back and OH, lunges, snatches and cleans that I have come to love-and sometimes dread.

As women, I believe we should try to be a little more supportive of each other as we can only do so much work with what we have and only have so much time in our busy days to do so.

Spiderchick, we all admire your 6 pack and the work it takes to get it and keep it, yet this is not a reality (or even a goal) for many of us.

Way too many of us have experienced eating 'issues' growing up with the wrong idea of what is skinny or ideal. This is not something I would wish on anyone. Lets try not to be so hard on those of us who are maybe not perfect but working hard, having lots of fun and happy with what we have.

Nothing makes me happier than seeing the success stories-like Lauren Parkers' last week, videos of Eva and the other super women of Crossfit and locally seeing how fellow Crossfit Mommies (you know who you are) have 'come back' from the joys of pregnancy healthier and stronger than ever.

This is really why Crossfit is such an amazing 'way of life.'

Just starting to mix crossfit back in with my heavy training need the cardio. I live in North Jersey, Morris County. Just wondering if there are any active crossfitters local to me and when and where people are doing the group thing.
JLake

I've never commented on the discussions on this board...

but, I know plenty of women who are fit and who have "the upper body of a dairy cow" aka big boobs (very tactful). Sure, it comes down to genetics, but blanket statements do not come across as well thought out. So what if someone doesn't feel like strictly monitoring their diet to be able to see their ribs (which I don't find particularly attractive...)? I'm not defending obesity here, but I'm sure that we can find some sort of middle ground. Someone above said "curvy doesn't mean fat or unfit" - how true.

I'm sure I could reduce my bodyfat from <10% (I've got a very visible six pack) down to extreme levels, but I'd rather eat food that appeals to me, even if it doesn't fall under the strict adherence to the zone. It's not everyone's priority to do so, and we shouldn't assume it is.

Just so no one misconstrues what I'm saying, health is extremely important to me, but I don't think the level of judgment I see on the comments today is appropriate. It just sounds so elitist. Girls who have six-packs - awesome. Those who don't - I don't deem all of you fatties who have no self control.

(obesity is another matter altogether that I'm not even going to touch on - I don't think there's any disagreement here that it's incredibly detrimental to one's health)

later.

Correlation does not imply causation.

The study claims that women with low WHR give superior brain building nutrients to their babies as compared to women with high WHR. This may be true.

An alternate explanation has been suggested above. Women with low WHR are biologically more sexually appealing to men. Therefore they have superior mating possibilities. Therefore they mate with superior, smarter men and give birth to smarter babies.

Again, correlation does not imply causation.

Juli:

I have heard of a definition of a win (or winner). It defines it as doing everything in your power to obtain the desired result. If you can achieve that level of effort while having defined the areas of impact, you have won. Luckily, we have a definition of impactful areas for fitness.

That doesn't mean people should sit around and say "I'm ok, you're ok, we are all ok". It just means that if people are honest in their self examination and give maximum effort to all impactful areas concerned (whether it be work, fitness, team sport, whatever) then you will "win". By your results, I would say you are definitely on the right track. Hang in there and stay strong!

Fit women are inherently more attractive, regardless of body type. I don't think curvy means fat at all. And don't knock the bubble butt. Soccer players are my kryptonite.

first, Pat, you are a force to be reckoned with.

now, the article. pardon me for my simplicity or internalized sensitivity, but i do like there to be some info out there that curvy is not terrible. curvy in our culture has a terrible connotation. curvy = fat. obviously spiderchick thinks so. at first her comments ticked me off so bad, then i just heard her frustration. while i do NOT agree with her statements, i have felt similar frustration -- mostly when i was made to feel awful for being "curvy" and not petite. (i am also 5'8".)

i have had a 65% WHR my whole adult life. both when i weighed 205 and now that i weigh 158. it took me close to 30 years to start to really appreciate how i WAS built and not the way WAS NOT. i love my curves and will, anatomically speaking, ALWAYS have them, regardless of the number i see on my scale everyday. that doesn't mean i am not going to bust my butt everyday to get better, stronger, faster!

something to think about -- audrey hepburn and marilyn monroe BOTH had WHR of 70%.

ck

Maybe women with certain waist/hip ratios have smarter kids is because men find those women more attractive, and stick around longer to help the kids with their math homework.

On a tangential topic, it seems as if the overweight (but not obese) population may have a lower death rate (my apologies if this has been discussed here before):

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9805E2D7103AF934A35752C1A9619C8B63

Excerpt:

"Linking, for the first time, causes of death to specific weights, they report that overweight people have a lower death rate because they are much less likely to die from a grab bag of diseases that includes Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, infections and lung disease. And that lower risk is not counteracted by increased risks of dying from any other disease, including cancer, diabetes or heart disease."

Just wanted to clarify... I guess, My idea of a low WHR was being seen thru the eyes of a athletic built fit adult. closer to 1. FOR example, let's say my waist is 30in and Hips 37in... thus a ratio of .8 but a body fat percent of 20%. (workin gon lower that)
Another woman, with a big tire around her waist, 46in, and 42in hips...1.1 and an obese body fat of 39%.
And yet another, woman with nothing to do but read Self, Cosmo, fitness magazines, and wonder what she could possibly do to get rid of her saddlebags... witha 26in waist and 34in hips; .76 but her body fat is about 28%.
In my mind, I was seeing a low WHR as being closer to 1 and not over. I was envisioning an athletic figure, a larger frame, small hip "healthy" adult, and a lean, no muscle pretty girl.
My point is only this...
It is ridiculous what gets published, what we, as a society try to make excuses for.

20/M/165

No rest today. Did Fran to catch up.

As RX'd:
7:56

Beat previous time by 40 seconds!

SHould have proofread... OOPS

What I meant was... I was envisioning an athletic figure...
(NIX the above larger frame, small hip, healthy adult...pretty girl.)at the end of my comment.

A WHR like ken-c pointed out.. (.6 to .7)

MSNBC Article about "amazing phenomenon" of how workout-oriented friendships and networks is beneficial to clients and gyms..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21817722/

who'da thunk it?

109 JPW

Spinal Tap...still the greatest mockumentary ever made.

Trying to get back on track with workouts.

Total 30 minutes, 5 minutes road bike on trainer/5 minutes rowing.
4.25 miles on bike.
3401 meters on rower.

Spider Chick, I have to say I completely agree with you on the media and what it puts out for society, however this has always been the case and it's never going to change. I do think you took this article the wrong way the examples they gave were of women who are anything but overweight. And many studies have been done on which "type" of body men prefers and usually "curvy" wins. If anything I think the media pushes being rail thin as what men prefer. So I always enjoy it when I read that men prefer curves to sticks. Having an hourglass figure and being overweight are two totally different things. I have been following CF for over 2 years and I was afraid to start because I didn't want to loose my curves. Well two plus years later I still have my curves just a smaller scale hourglass. We can change a lot of things about ourselves, however we cannot change our body structure. I think it's great that you are happy with your figure, although you should take into account we were not all cut from the same cloth.

Juli you are making great progress!! Keep up the good work and you will be kipping before you know it.

You know, I saw the Rest Day post this AM and was working all morning. I was working up some wise-a$$ comment about "round being a curve" and ruminating on "convex vs. concave" curves. You know, typical egghead nonsense that would tickle me and just cause everyone else to shake their head sadly.

Boy, am I glad I read the above first. Whew. Nope, gonna pass on this one. Pseudo-science about female body shapes? Uh uh, not me. Somehow, though, the image of Coach rolling around his desk laughing just won't leave...

Spider Chick #60, you are the best! Funny, outspoken, hot.
Did weighted pulls today, pb at 90 lbs, missed 100 by 2 centimetres! Next time.

Hari - LOL! I think you're safe in your thought that fathers are at least partially responsible for their children- isn't that what Bill Cosby has been trying to say? - wait you said for their cognitive abilities - well, that, too! (I'm glad you said strong bones for your theory and not big bones - that would probably spark even more discontent!)

Juli (U'i) - keep your head up, girl! You're not going to be unpopular because of your comments - they need to be heard. You should be REALLY proud of yourself. It is even more difficult to go from NO physical health to where you are than from good physical health to elite physical health.

Spider Chick - I appreciate your passion for fitness, but I can't help thinking that a girl who cracks nuts with her cheeks is going to scare the boys off! (although I do like the ring of "nut-crackin' butt")

I would like to know where the idea that the media wants to push fat chicks being Hotties comes from? Ummmm...what t.v. /magazines are others looking at? I must have missed something - I see mostly really skinny people. (even Al Roker and Oprah are fairly normal sized now) Sure, there're advertisements for non-healthy items and some moronic headlines, but I don't buy this particular media conspiracy theory.

M/25/215/6'4"

WOD: Tuesday 071127
Rest day; as rx'd

Trying for 23h 15 min.Man this was tough..four days ago...But I think I'll manage to get through it today.

i've always thought that one of the many aspects of genius to crossfit is that results and progress are measured by performance on the wods and not on inches or pounds lost or the size of your bicepts or whatever. the best body shape that person can have just naturally emerges from doing the workouts. kinda zen-like really. give up being concerned about your body shape and focus on your fran time and so forth and the best body you can have just happens.

U'i -- congrats, i hear you sister! keep after it!

chantal -- amen to you, too! keep posting, i always look for the tall girls' postings and times!

ck

In a perfect world, we all live in the coastal California weather, work 30 hours/week (and work out another 8-10 hours/week), and can afford all the healthy food money can buy. Sadly, this is not the case for the majority of America. Extremes are just that--extremes. So for every SpiderChick (nothing personal here) there's someone else at the other end of the bell curve. My point is that they are the exceptions.

You can't assume it's a universal goal that everyone WANTS to be fit and strong (especially the fish-in-a-barrel fat people that CF'ers often deride). For example, if we are to believe the longevity purists, then we would all be eating 1,000 calories/day and living low-intensity lives. That's another form of fanaticism, geared toward their goals. Not my thing.

Me? I'm something of a CF convert, having spent the last couple months transitioning from years of "traditional" weight routines (very bodybuilding-inspired) to the intense power-endurance routine that CF is based upon. I like the ability to cross-train for climbing, playing with my niece and nephew, and all manner of housework and yardwork. That's where I derive my quality of life--from really living. If that means by bf% never drops below 10%, so be it. My fanaticism only goes so far. YMMV, of course ;)

No rest today. 1 dodgeball doubleheader + 3 pull-ups every time I get knocked out of a game = big fun.

As for today's topic, I think we should worry less about dimensions and ratios and more about performance and results. What's important is not how you look, but what you can do. The more you can do, the better you'll look. A woman who looks strong and fit is hot. A woman who smokes me in Fran is hotter.

I think there are now two parts to this discussion. The first is about the article and whether or not the correlation of WHR has anything to do with offspring mental development, which may just be some statistical anomaly lining up with their ideas, or it may warrant some further study to nail down what is really happening. This is how science works. There is something happening in the world (data), someone notices a pattern, they then try to correlate and find a cause that is repeatable and measurable. I don't think they've proven anything, they just found some possible link. Good, now they need to figure out what is really happening and come back when they are done and explain it to us in terms we'll understand.

The second issue at hand is what I'd like to call 'the idea of cultural image versus the truth of fitness'. Spider Chick's rant, whether you agree with her or not, brings up some interesting points about how the media is pushing on us images of what is good and/or the norm for a person in this day and age. What I see at the root of the problem is the fact that they are selling something, whether papers or ads, airtime or actual goods, each one is trying to make money and that means they have to make you buy into what they are selling/saying. They show pictures of the latest runway models or Hollywood starlet and tell you that you can be like them if you just take these easy steps, and you buy what they are selling. Or then they tell you it is okay to stay the way you are because more and more people are becoming "large" and just you don't worry about it because we have products that will make your life easier. And really there are easy ways to be more healthy than the other guys... and isn't life just like running into a grizzly bear on a hike through the woods? You don't have to be the fastest, you just have to be faster than the slowest person in the group. You don't have to be healthy, you just have to be healthier than the people who are dying of their unhealthy lifestyle.

The point- They are all trying to sell something to you and the more pleasant and easier it is on you (the better it makes you feel), the more likely you are to buy it. So what about CrossFit? I've only been here for 8 months, but what I've so far heard from Coach is that CrossFit works and he has the info to back it up and is willing to give it away for free, but YOU have to do the work. It will not be easy, in fact it probably will be tough and taxing and some days you may not like it at all, but the results speak for themselves. Take it or leave it... and it looks like most of us are taking it and bringing others with us.

And in closing, I'd like to paraphrase something I think Coach said, 'CrossFit is about fitness, not about looking hot. Though it is very nice that one of the bonuses of being fit is looking hot.'

#110- JPW

Thanks for the Spinal Tap ref. It made me laugh out loud. Anything by Christopher Guest is a classic in my book =)

I did 40 pullups for the Eugene Allen Challenge today, a pr by 14. Alas, I did yesterday's weighted pullups, but my earlier exertions may have taken their toll, failed at my previous pr of 100, got my chin to the bar at 95. Happy Birthday Eugene. BW:170 Y/A:59

Is there an official Crossfit stretching routine?

#139 Jimi....I'm not knocking the bubble butt, I KILL the WODs with lunge steps and squats!

f/125

1st time "Elizabeth" today

21-15-9 reps of:
Clean 135 pounds (60 lbs)
Ring dips (gravitron)

11:44

ouch.

I did the weighted pull ups today.

First time doing a max weight style so I wanted to establish a baseline today.

45/50/55/60/65/70/80 + a failed 90.

Next time I'll probably start around 70 and work from there.

Is there any money in having your own gym? I feel like fitness and helping people get in shape is my passion but I don't want to end up like a