just got back from lvl 1 cert in Mesa and am very excited as is my wife. we started yesterday as day one of "post baby CF".

**15min stretching and talking about CF, how it is incorporated into daily life, how to make WODS, how we're going to doher WOD. (she had to listen while we were stretching.)

**20min on squating form with no more than 7 aquats in a row without a break.

**10min on push up form from knees.

**10min on lunge form.

**15min cool down streteching. we used some yoga stretches as we both like that stuff.

**5-10min designing second day WOD for her.

her motivation is high and I'm trying to keep soreness to a 2 or 3 on 1-10 scale so she doesn't want to give up and can still function through out day. Next week will introduce low weight PVC for thrusters, presses and will start intro to Kettle Bells.

Late post, but everybody did the WOD today.
Chayil- 8:43
Cory- 9:06
Terry- 12:08
Kerry- 13:15
Aleks- 13:41
Lydia- 17:52
Misha- 17:52
Maxim- 31:02
Master Lee- 13:05 with all double unders

Oooohhh, rest. I was really expecting another WOD today. In fact, I'm a little disappointed...

I'm staking today's rest on a FGB or another super-intense named WOD tomorrow.

just got back from lvl 1 cert in Mesa and am very excited as is my better half. we started yesterday as day one of "post baby CF".

it went like this

15min stretching and talking about CF, how it is incorporated into daily life, how to make WODS, how we're going to doher WOD. (she had to listen while we were stretching.)

20min on squating form with no more than 7 aquats in a row without a break.

10min on push up form from knees.

10min on lunge form.

15min cool down streteching. we used some yoga stretches as we both like that stuff.

5-10min designing second day WOD for her.

her motivation is high and I'm trying to keep soreness to a 2 or 3 on 1-10 scale so she doesn't want to give up and can still function through out day. Next week will introduce low weight PVC for thrusters, presses and will start intro to Kettle Bells.

she did a wod of 5 rounds of 10squats and 6 push ups today. form was good, you could really see the cocentration as she got tired. I think we're going to be creating a cf junkie/ monster. she is already asking about tomorrow.

rest well

11yrs of crossfit WOW..... i guess it works... j/k I know it works.... I was hooked when i passed the 3 month point and wasn't hurt. Amazing shoulder recovery(when I was told that it would never recover), from daily back pain to pain free. just my story....
thanks Coach

Great interview I6 and EvaT!

"It's like playtime...I'll never get tired of it."

Ditto

Looks to me like Gary Taubes' "Good Calories, Bad Calories" is finally getting through to people about the fallacy of dietary fat leading to obesity (and carbs being innocuous):

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/09/science/09tier.html?ex=1349668800&en=67642ef2330
f51af&ei=5124&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink
(excerpt from NY Times' John Tierney: "Diet and Fat: A Severe Case of Mistaken Consensus")

“In the case of fatty foods, that confident voice belonged to Ancel Keys, a prominent diet researcher a half-century ago.... He became convinced in the 1950s that Americans were suffering from a new epidemic of heart disease because they were eating more fat than their ancestors.

There were two glaring problems with this theory, as Mr. Taubes, a correspondent for Science magazine, explains in his book. First, it wasn’t clear that traditional diets were especially lean. Nineteenth-century Americans consumed huge amounts of meat; the percentage of fat in the diet of ancient hunter-gatherers, according to the best estimate today, was as high or higher than the ratio in the modern Western diet.

Second, there wasn’t really a new epidemic of heart disease. Yes, more cases were being reported, but not because people were in worse health. It was mainly because they were living longer and were more likely to see a doctor who diagnosed the symptoms.

To bolster his theory, Dr. Keys in 1953 compared diets and heart disease rates in the United States, Japan and four other countries. Sure enough, more fat correlated with more disease (America topped the list). But critics at the time noted that if Dr. Keys had analyzed all 22 countries for which data were available, he would not have found a correlation. (And, as Mr. Taubes notes, no one would have puzzled over the so-called French Paradox of foie-gras connoisseurs with healthy hearts.)

The evidence that dietary fat correlates with heart disease ‘does not stand up to critical examination,’ the American Heart Association concluded in 1957. But three years later the association changed position — not because of new data, Mr. Taubes writes, but because Dr. Keys and an ally were on the committee issuing the new report. It asserted that ‘the best scientific evidence of the time’ warranted a lower-fat diet for people at high risk of heart disease.”

44/M/6'/180

GOOD!

RURAL/METRO FIRE DEPT.
TUCSON, AZ.

I have four WODs I made to target weaknesses of mine, while keeping to the idea of a weightlifting/gymnastic couplet that maximizes "neuroendocrine response". I've given them names. I feel like a dork sharing them. The first two are from Shakespeare. The third is from a Mozart opera, the fourth from a Puccini opera. I would have picked famous Marines or recent heroes but they're all men's names, so here goes:

SOPHIA
For time:
21-15-9
135 lb. front squats
Pull-ups

LAVINIA
For time:
21-15-9
95 lb. overhead squats
Pull-ups

SUSANNA
5 rounds for time:
20 double-unders
10 burpees

MIMI
3 rounds for time:
50 kb swings (1 pood, or 35 lb. dumbbell)
25 box jumps (24" box)

no sound--any one else? I want to thear the big man speak.

just got in from working out then dinner and a drink or 3 so late on the post.

squats and jump rope as rx'd 9:25

if linda and murph are the marathons then this one was a sprint. liked it a lot.

Thank the LORD for a rest day.

I'm not sore yet from today's workout but I can feel it coming on.

My body will do well with a rest tomorrow.

John

I don't much enjoy the geo-political aspect of the story written on 'Russian knowledge' of the secret but not really secret oil in the Earth; the geo-political aspect IS there so i'll take it as it is. Maybe with the terrorist attacks on 9-11-2001 the United States gained a politically "reasonable" reason to invade another country, oust its' leaders, and put in a democratic system, i agree with the idea and i am happy that we are trying to rid the world of terrorism. Oil and the companies relying on it now comes into play, the great liberal media tends to push the idea of diminishing oil fields, not because it is true or because they believe the fossil-theory, but really because it helps THEIR cause of energy reform, nature protection, so on and so forth. So the US companies and their allies have the notion that oil is still from fossils? yes, it seems so from this article i.e. US Wildcat drilling 10% success rate...What are we thinking? The economoy is now a WORLD economy we cannot be isolated in our own bubble of goods or resources, we need to adopt what seems to be a scientifically based style that the Russians have put to good use. Will we ever know if the Iraqi Freedom surge was for oil or to oust Saddam? probably many years in the future, but oil had to have been on the minds of our countries leaders because...if it wasn't...they are beyond ignorant.

awesome interview.

and those buddy lee videos are a big help, especially the one that taught the double under. such a simple technique, but it works so well. i was able to get 9 consecutive double unders today using that power jump technique!! sooo happy =D

oh yeah, and nadia your 7:01 on that workout is just a monster time! you must have been on the verge of spontaneous combustion.

I6 and Eva T - Great Interview! 2:34 Grace, Did I hear that right? Unbelievable.

Oil is coming from the earth's crust? That is a mighty big revelation. 60% success in oil drilling is phenomenal so that certainly suggests their science has merit. Still, I don't buy that the Iraq war is about a price war with the Russians. Why wouldn't we just pay the Russians to find the oil on our continent? Then we could be done with the Middle East completely without spilling any blood. I'm definitely going to do some research.

Late posting on the WOD (it's still before 12am CST)

Squats and jump rope as Rx'd

Time: ... yeah, about that... must have double hit the start/stop button on the stop-watch. Didn't catch it until the end of round 3. Finished the last 2 rounds in 4:11. That would average to about 10:25 overall, though I know I did the first 3 rounds faster than the last two so maybe I was under 10:00...??? I hate not knowing what my time really was!

Nice interview I6. And I'm glad you got to do some interviewing of Eva T. 11 years and still going strong. I like it!

Does anyone in the Phoenix area go to a crossfit gym like the one in Tempe? I haven't had a chance to get up there yet but I was wondering if there are any other ones around? I live in Mesa and would like to find one closer to where I live.

I6,
You are awesome...I will interview and be interviewed with you on any day. We will have to fit in a workout in there as well. Thanks for serving our country! I know you are heading overseas soon. Take Care.

Oh Dear...

Well, I guess it's official. Forever immortalized on teh InterWebz. Thanks (to TonyB?) for the editing (read: thx for not letting me look too bad).

EvaT was really cool. I have to admit when I first saw her I was like "OMG, thats Eva".

I'm not worthy! ;-)

I6

I feel as if I cheated the last three days, can we have some harder workouts like the three pior.
I'm a squad leader station'd in Iraq right now and I take my guys to do the WOD when I can, needless to say we have made leaps and bounds thanks to your workouts keep them coming

Should have got some video of the back of that Valley Crossfit shirt: "Trample the Weak Hurdle the Dead" Coolest crossfit shirt ever.

Great interview you 2.

I hardly think that this single article is the trump card that unveils a 'liberal conspiracy.' At best it says we should take a look at whatever the Russians are doing. I'm not an expert or even knowledgable about how they find oil. I am smart enough to approach things skeptically and not outright accept them because they fit nicely into my world view. There is no way to tell if his stats are even close to being accurate (I'm betting they are not accurate) and to take this article at face value would be similar to accepting the faked moon landing conspiracy as truth because you saw the show on the Discovery Channel.

Jay H, we have practically the same name. haha

Eva and I6, you rock!

"trample the weak Hurdle the dead" love it

Abiotic oil? That's a laugh. This article is a wonderful example of pseudoscience. I urge those reading it to be very, very skeptical.

Disclaimer: I am a Penn State trained geologist. According to the author, this makes me wedded to the "holy truth" of petroleum's biotic origins.

Let's look at just a few of the article's assertions:

>That would mean that dinosaur remains became
>compressed and over tens of millions of years
>fossilized and were trapped in underground
>reservoirs perhaps 1,200-2,000 meters below the
>surface of the Earth

Ugh. Dinosaur remains is very misleading. Large algae beds probably formed the source material for petroleum called kerogen. Typical depths for finding oil are 4,000 to 6,000 meters below the surface. This is commonly called the "oil window." It can be found much shallower, too. However, remember that 4,000 to 6,000 meter number.

>It claims that the conventional US biological-
>origins theory is an unscientific absurdity that
>is unprovable.

It's very provable. In fact, there's overwhelming evidence that petroleum came from organisms. Petroleum is full of biological markers.

>Oil is a primordial material of deep origin which
>is transported at high pressure via 'cold'
>eruptive processes into the crust of the Earth

Ah, yes. The something for nothing argument. What are these cold eruptive processes? Beats me. Anything coming up from deep in the earth's surface is very hot. Hence we have volcanoes spewing molten rock, not petroleum.

>A total of 61 wells were drilled, of which 37
>were commercially productive, an extremely
>impressive exploration success rate of almost
>60%. The size of the field discovered compared to
>the North Slope of Alaska. By contrast, US
>wildcat drilling was considered to have a 10%
>success rate. Nine of 10 wells are typically "dry
>holes".

61 wells is a really small sample size. Russia's oil industry has probably drilled tens of thousands of test holes. I would guess their success rate is somewhere around the US success rate of about 1 in 3, not 1 in 10 as stated above. Note, finding oil does not mean you can produce it at a profit. Drilling for and extracting oil is an amazingly complex affair.

If I were to selectively pick 61 wells drilled in Saudi Arabia's main oil field (Ghawar), I bet you I could find a high success rate, too.

>He [M. King Hubbert] predicted that US oil
>production would peak in 1970.

Hubbert was correct to within about 12 months. Pretty impressive, actually. Hubbert was ridiculed for his ideas until he was proven correct.

>A modest man, he named the production curve he
>invented Hubbert's Curve, and the peak as
>Hubbert's Peak.

Hubbert didn't name them, others did.

>The only problem was, it peaked not because of
>resource depletion in the US fields. It "peaked"
>because Shell, Mobil, Texaco and the other
>partners of Saudi Aramco were flooding the US
>market with dirt-cheap imports from the Middle
>East, tariff-free, at prices so low California
>and many Texas domestic producers could not
>compete and were forced to shut their wells.

Absolutely false. We peaked and nothing is ever going to bring us back from that. The physics that govern oil fields are very complicated, but reasonably well understood. Oil fields are developed, they mature, and then decline. Every time. No exceptions. By the way, Russia, Mexico, and the North Sea peaked as well. Saudi Arabia may be at or near peak. Sound troubling? It is.

>They then went to Vietnam in the 1980s and
>offered to finance drilling costs to show that
>their new geological theory worked. Russian
>company Petrosov drilled in Vietnam's White Tiger
>oilfield offshore into basalt rock some 5,000
>meters down and extracted 6,000 barrels a day of
>oil to feed the energy-starved Vietnam economy.

Remember what I said about the "oil window?" 5,000 meters is where you might expect to find oil.

>Western geologists do not bother to offer hard
>scientific proof of fossil origins.

Oh yes they do. Mountains of it. You'd have to read some geologic journals, but biotic origins are not in doubt. Nor is the theory of plate tectonics. However, you can find some crackpot geologists that don't believe that either. There's a Flat Earth Society, too. That you are driving a car is proof of just how damn good geologists are at finding oil - all based on biotic origins.

I need to get some sleep. However, before you believe that the earth is just full of petroleum like a chocolate bonbon filled with caramel, you need to do just a cursory bit of research. This author is woefully unacquainted with the facts and has made no attempt to actually learn anything about petroleum geology. It is a truly dreadful piece of journalism.

Nice, John! You're official now, you made the Homepage!

Mike
www.valleycrossfit.com

Thanks Tom C. My skepticism proves useful once again. I just looked up some of the information you talked about.

That is one problem with so many neocon ideas, they will actually just make stuff up to try to push their agenda. I'm a liberatarian or classic liberal myself. It makes it easy to see the holes in both of our political parties in the US. Our political system and government are in a bad way right now.

33/M/175

Yesterday's WOD
10:18

Agree with Tom C. I'd offer as parallel evidence Lysenkoism. And the wonderful track record of the Soviets in all their economic statistics - the party names have changed, but the nomenklatura is still running the show.

Jay H - the neocons didn't say anything about going to Iraq for oil.The neocons believe in pushing liberty. The "war for oil" is another specious accusation from those out of political power, and justifiably so.

Hey everyone!
I want to make a set of PARALLETTES and I know that I read an article on how to make them with pvc pipe, etc, somewhere on the CFHQ site or on a site that was linked, but can't for the life of me remember where it is.
Does anyone have any direction for me?
Thank you very much in advance!
J
"Train Hard or Go the F$#@ Home!"

EvaT and I6-
Great interviews, both.

Eva- I agree with you that there is never anything to get bored with, because there is always something to work on. Although, what I have to work on is probably a much, much, much longer list than yours!

JPW-
Look into the oil production in Central Asia (Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan) and see who they are selling it to. I'll give you two guesses who.

Kate
(Off to take on the Bear)

I6, Great meeting you at the OLY Cert. I am glad we got to hang out.

Awsome point about Patriotism or anything else for that matter. Call a spade a spade. When those on the left realize that every despot and scumbag on the planet either parrots them or the left parrots the scumbags and despots, perhaps they will come around to discourse without the need to 'strain' reality to fit their world view.

Article. I get where the guy is coming from accept the VP Chenney part. Seems like a shallow Bill Maher comment that he does not even remotely substantiate. The point from the right is not that we are running out of oil, so attack the middle east. The point is the left wont allow anymore domestic exploration, thus giving economic rise to despotic thugs who threaten our national security and the world economic engine.

I have read articles lately about, once thought, depleted oil fields refilling. Makes more sense to me than rotted dinosour parts and other bio-mass. By definition either way it is still 'finite' , but to what extent is the point.

Either way, there are things that are already energy that we can use if we can harness them as they go by.

Question relating to the butterfly effect. If a butterfly flapping its wings can translate or contribute to a hurricain half a world away, do wind mill farms absorbing wind 'energy' have an unforseen effect on the environment by absorbing that wind force? Do windmills in the hills of California effect the high pressure system moving across Asia?

OMG! My hero! Infidel Six! Funniest guy on the planet.

And, The Eva. Our Queen Hera from Mt. Olympus.

Great interview.

And now for a small bit of observable, repeatable, measurable results from my little corner of the spider web:

My neighbor was a self described, "big girl". She liked to compensate by being "funny". IE: shoveling ice cream into her gob and saying in a Scarlett O'Hara voice, "Ashley Wilkes likes to see a girl with a healthy appetite." She laughed herself into morbid obesity, and labeled my CrossFit obsession as PTSD post-war nutz.

One year after I begin CrossFit, her body is almost half fat (no kidding, I measured), and I'm wearing size zero jeans and doing L-Sit pullups off of tree limbs.

She comes over in tears and asks for help. Not so funny any more, huh? Ashley Wilkes likes to see a girl with abs and a high & tight butt, doesn't he?

At the beginning of September, we begin our little experiment in my basement laboratory. She goes B2theW every time. It hurts, she cries, but she doesn't quit and doesn't waste my time. She loses a dress size. Even her bra & underpants are loose. She's still shoveling in the groceries and I nag her about the Zone.

She decides that CrossFit's working and I might be onto something. Three weeks into our experiment, she quits telling me that she knows how to diet (I earned heavenly points by holding a straight face to that one, considering she hadn't lost a single pound and umm... well, ahem, my opinion was that she did NOT know how to eat like an athlete). So, we get out my Zone books and the measuring cups, and she gives the zone a try. She immediatly begins to lose metric tonnage daily, and off goes another dress size in a week.

It's been a month and a week. She's gone from 44% BF to 34% BF (measured with the technique & tables from "Mastering the Zone"). She's lost 10 lbs & 3 dress sizes. She's getting so fit that I wonder if she's going to be stronger and faster than me. She's got the zone dialed in and does it every day, and if she gets stupid & eats something dumb, she's truthful and tells me (I make her keep a food diary). She's gotten out of shopping at the Lane Bryant fat girl clothes stores and can fit her shrinking caboose into Ann Taylor. She's never hungry. She sees that she's an athlete in training. I have her repeating, "sugar is of the devil".

She stalks around now: a totally different walk that has lost its lumbering trundle of obesity and now has a swing & a bounce that says, "I'm Hot!" Her big pillowy body has slimmed down to the point where her arms can hang by her side instead of resting on a shelf of fat over her love handles and butt. Everyone who knows her comments on how good she looks. Positive reinforcement is rolling in like a tidal wave.

She's getting treated differently by people. They notice her now. She's started to matter to herself and others. Dudes are checkin' out the hottie and she feels it.

I've done a lot of stuff in my life. Some noble, some horrible. But, this one thing: the saving of this one woman from her path of obesity, diabetes, inconsequence, hiding behind fat jokes, hating herself, and a heart attack before age 50..

this one thing: sharing CrossFit and obtaining the measurable, repeatable results of health in this one poor woman who's now becoming a hot force of nature, I gotta say, is the most satisfying thing I have ever done. I can only imagine what it feels like to be a trainer at Santa Cruz. There's gotta be a new word for my euphoria plus one.

At the end of her workouts, we're busily trying to thank each other. She's thankful for her health and hot body that gets yummier every day. I'm thankful for her trust, her discipline and for allowing me the chance to feel like what I am doing really matters (and I know I'm not doing anything other than acting as a pipeline to pass along Greg Glassman's fitness program).

When I move to DC, I'm turning her over to the capable coaching of Tony Young.

Anyhow, props to my neighbor, and props to the CrossFit method. Who'd have thought it: by teaching CrossFit to someone else, you can actually feel even better than you feel from doing it yourself.

Religious Saudis believe that Allah will replenish the oil under the Holy Land.

If only Christians would believe the same. C'mon Christians! Pray for oil!

“Big Oil wants to sustain high oil prices. US Vice President Dick Cheney and friends are all too willing to assist.” (Paragraph 1)

Okay, so far so good. Evil Dick Cheney wants to help his evil oil buddies drive up prices. Now, one would think that if you wanted to drive up prices (e.g., make that oil sitting in your buddies’ Texas oil wells worth $500 per barrel) then you would like to see oil prices rise. You’d like to see cheap oil get off the market. When evil businessmen conspire to screw the public, don’t they all agree to restrict supply and raise prices, not increase supply and lower prices?

But, apparently Cheney is going to increase oil prices by gaining access to cheap oil in Iraq. And that’s why we invaded Iraq? Huh? Once Cheney sets up his puppet government in Iraq, it is going to do what? Flood the world with cheap oil or expensive oil?

Look, if some people want to believe that (1) Cheney completely controls US policy; (2) fooled the US Senate into authorizing military force; (3) orchestrated the Republicans loss of both houses so that he could then; (4) continues to trick the Democratic-controlled congress into continuing to fund the war; (5) and does all this to help out his friends; I’m fine with that. Where I draw the line is at economically irrational (as opposed to just plain irrational) theories.

If you want to raise the price of oil, you restrict its supply. (Think OPEC) Before we invaded Iraq, we had sanctions on Hussein that limited the amount of oil he could sell (i.e., reduced world output). Less Iraqi oil on the market means higher prices. More Iraqi oil on the market means lower oil prices.

You simply can’t have it both ways.

And by the way, couldn’t Cheney have gotten the job done more simply just by invading Alaska or at least authorizing drilling up there?

I6: pleased to make your acquaintance!

Coach, Tony B: what a great series. I6, Apollowabbie, CCTJoey, Nadia Shatilla, Hari, Dammit, and on and on and on. Great stuff. When do we get to make the acquaintance of the self-described skinny little blond major, Spider Chick?

I6, good luck and Godspeed on your posting. Don't forget to write...

I6,

Great interview!

Good luck. Stay safe, and if you can, please keep posting.

Tom C.

Great rebuttal to the article. You should listen to this audio interview with the same guy, I'd love to hear your reaction to it as well.

Anytime someone uses the words destruction, cataclysmic, massive, catastrophic, insane, over and over again to try to over-sell their position, I get a little skeptical. But he does make some interesting observations.

http://www.ecoshock.org/downloads/energy/ES_Engdahl_Biofuels.mp3

ON another note:

anybody else get the feeling that the last three days have lulled us into a false sense of security, and tomorrow's WOD will introduce us to new worlds of prolonged discomfort?

I6

God speed and good luck to you. Thanks for expressing many of my views far more articulate than I can. Your opinions have so much more credibility when you understand you are about to go into harms way, than these liberals who rant about oil. How quickly we forget.

I was also impressed you got one of the elite ladies to interview you and vice versa. We can not get to much of Eva and other elite ladies.

Also I guess Nadia is now one, 7:01 WOW.

Tried to post last night, but don't think the server got through.

I doubled up on the strength workouts
5x3 squats
7x1 weighted pullups
The stats are:
Squats: 315/335/355/375/415
Weighted pullups: 100/110/115/120/125/130(2reps)/130(4reps) The gym only goes up to 130# dumbells.

I'll double up again today on the squat/jumprope and 21-15-9 hndstndpu/dips/pushups in order to catch up.

31/m/180

Spider Chick,

I have tears in my eyes from reading your post. Tell your neighbor congratulations for making herself count. Spider Chick, you have taken what the Glassmans have given us and paid it forward in spades. The saving of lives - even if it is just one - is the noblest of causes. Thank you for your work. I always look forward to your posts.

Pilar

Jay H #28,

There's nothing Neocon about the article. Nothing.

It is, however, full of liberal nostrums. Full.

Spider Chick

That’s amazing! It’s a wonderful thing to give of your time and expertise and I’m sure I’m not alone in feeling blessed that you’ve shared the story with us.

But now you’ve opened a can of worms! I want to know more about your friend’s progress. AND I want to know what you’ve done this past month to elicit such an immediate and significant response. So how about starting a thread on the messageboard to inform us of her progress? Again, I’m sure I wouldn’t be the only noob to be fascinated with such a post.

Anyway, thanks again for the story and inspiration. You rock!

#31.

sent you an email with directions attached.

I6, great interview and way to turn the tables! Loved learning about both you and Eva T! 2:34 grace? holy crap!

Spider Chick- great story, you are changing this girls life.

Ken C #15 and Kevin McClellan #40-
I am paying for it today. my calves have never been so sore!

comment/question: I'm in my 3rd week of the zone and weighed in this morning at 108, started at 113. This seems a bit fishy to me, but I always weigh myself first thing in the morning to try to get an accurate reading. My calories are significantly less, was at 2100-2300 and now around 1600-1800. I'm surprised that I am not hungry. I used to wake up 3-5 times per night starving and would have to eat or I could not get back to sleep. Since starting the zone I've only had 3-5 nights where I am waking up to eat and it's only 1-2 times per night (those were also days where I cheated with some wine or extra carbs when out with friends). I guess I am just shocked at how I'm feeling more satisfied on less calories! Gonna keep at it, just time for some new recipes because broccoli and tofu are getting old real quick!

Kate, good luck with the bear. I think I might try that this afternoon too.

Nadia, Just curious why you are eating so few calories? Surely you're not trying to lose weight? Is 1600-1800 kcal enough to support all your activity, including crossfit workouts?

Tim #47

It was recomended I try 11-12 blocks and I entered in everything I was eating into fitday and it came up between 1600-1800cals (fitday is strange and won't let me enter in exact amounts, things are set at tablespoon rather then teaspoon and slice rather then oz etc). I'll try entering everything again today and see if I get a different number. I'm doing (6) 2 block meals/snacks, and my carbs are comming from broccoli, lettuce and green beans. 2 1/2 cups of broccoli is so filling but I guess has few calories.

I'm not trying to lose weight, just want to be faster, stronger and well honestly look ripped like my she-beast heroes nicole, annie, and eva t!

#31 J the Bear,
click here (w/f/s): http://www.drillsandskills.com/skills/cond
also check out the layout image.

More help is on the forum. Also, go to the rest of the drillsandskills site for enough progressions to keep you busy for years.

#34 Spider Chick,
that's awesome, way to spread the goodness!

Interview: well, when you put it like that... lol. Truly there is a line between valuable and dumb discussion, and I like how you and others push for the former. Awesome interview all around.

Article: so far I am swayed by Tom C. Even drilling in Alaska would only delay oil's economic feasibility a short amount of time (months? a couple years?) Alaskans are all for it because oil represents one of Alaska's few, large industries. However, for every input towards a product, there's an output. Raw materials arrive at high entropy and leave at low entropy, as "finished goods." If inputs don't emerge as desired products, they must appear as undesired-products or wastes.
Negative externalities are at one level geographically localized (airport polution, smog, etc). Some also give rise to larger-scale effects like, oh boy, global warming.

If positive externalities - liked shared costs for facilities and utilities found in urban areas - are good, what are the (eventual) economic effects of these negative externalities?

Also, the world economy in general, and in this case environmental effects in particular, tend to result in profits gained in the developed world at the expense of the developing world. Consider the 1980s "lost decade," or increased famine in Africa and harsh tsunamis in South-East Asia as environmental examples.
Of course, I am relying on the idea that humans impact the Earth's environment.

The anti-Western stance of the article is shaky, as Tom C. points out. The speculation about the Iraq invasion, well... let's say oil was/is a factor but not THE factor.

Nadia,

Gotcha. There are two great websites that I think you'll really like. You may have seen them already. One is whfoods.com (The world's healthiest foods) It lists all the most nutrient dense foods by category. It is really well put together, and a great resource.
For checking calorie and nutrient values of foods try this:
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

You can input virtually any food in any quantity, and get a complete profile of its nutritional content.

#50, Ben, writes:

"Also, the world economy in general, and in this case environmental effects in particular, tend to result in profits gained in the developed world at the expense of the developing world. Consider the 1980s 'lost decade,' or increased famine in Africa and harsh tsunamis in South-East Asia as environmental examples.
Of course, I am relying on the idea that humans impact the Earth's environment."

Are you saying that the US is in any way, shape, or form responsible for either the famine in Africa or the tsunamis in South-East Asia?

Tom C, great post. Thanks!

Spider Chick: Great story! I would like to see where she is at 1 year from now and how much better her body performs. Thanks for sharing.

CFWUx1
BWUx2
HPS practice
ohs 179lbs bw
95x5
135x5
185x12/10/8/4
GHD situps 3x20
sp 3x10 alt feet practice
spider chick inspiring story keep us updated. Thanks Coach!

Question About Nutirtion: Do you guys/gals know if Mastering the Zone complies with the low gi diet?? Ive heard that it is outdated and wanted to know what yall think.

The article supposes that our presence in Iraq constitutes our control of oil in the Middle East. Sorry but there's a lot more to the Middle East than just Iraq. I agree with Hari (#36?) that it would be a lot easier if we want more oil to just drill in Alaska. I lived there for 3 years and can tell you that, 1, there's enough Alaska up there for us to drill without causing even close to a significant amount of harm to the environment, and 2, Alaskan's are all for it. Another thing the article mentions is an American scientific belief that oil comes from old pressurized dinosaurs. Personally, I believe in a "young earth", i.e. not millions of years old, and (not being a scientist myself) tend to lean towards the "Russian" theory that oil is deep, available, and abiotic. Last thought; I'm really excited about all of the "new military bases that we're building around Russia". Seeing as I'm active duty military, that's going to afford a lot more travel opportunities. . . ha.

hey had a question on my mind last couple days seen if any of yall can answer it for me.... would a sport specific crossfit reginmine be any different than the wod's? say for me training for football as i am wanting to build speed and power? dunno just thought id ask

#34 Spider Chick

Great post Spider Chick...good to see the world of obesity is shrinking by one plump body. Please keep us updated on your friend's progress and tell her we're cheering her on!! And I think we'll be waiting for your interview.

yey, rest day :). this is my first week of crossfit.. im loving it!!

My body is really tired, but I cant wait for the nxt WOD.

I6: nice to put a name with face. Definitely keep on keeping on.

Eva: always glad to see you. Your name came up at the Kettlebell seminar: Jeff Martone is working on his Eva T. Turkish getup. He's not sure the weight, but he's pretty sure that an Olympic Weightlifting champion that is solid muscle is more than 100 lb.

With respect to the article, I get this impression of a massively myopic person trying to read the label on a medicine bottle. He can't quite make it out, so like Mr. McGoo he makes something up.

How else to explain the war in Iraq? Well, how about the reams of debate and argument that went on before it happened? How about including the previous war and period thereafter? It's almost comical how he dismisses all of that--A-L-L of that--with a snap of a finger, and an assertion that is contrary to the received reality of pretty much the entire population of this and other countries.

Hari and others have pointed to obvious logical fallacies in the argument, and I would like simply to state a psychological point: it's reassuring to reduce very complex phenoneman and systems over which we have no personal control, to one or two basic, simple processes. This does not mean they are right, but if the need is to reduce anxiety, it works, paradoxically.

Paradoxically, because the explanation involves conspiracy. "They" become the villains, and even though "they" are well entrenched in global power structures, if we can someone get "them" out of power, everything good will happen.

This basic process is likely as old as mankind, and it is a species of deep irony that it is mainly Leftists that want to invoke this "demonization of the Other", when in fact they are generally the principle practioners of it.

How else does Cheney get blamed for things over which he cannot conceivably have control? How else do these elaborate, invisible, machinations get built in the minds of those accusing him of ever manner of deviltry, while ignoring entirely the fact that Cheney is not even President?

And the point here is not making generalizations. It is making generalizations that cannot be supported by evidence or other forms of observation. The argument that Cheney could have done something--when in fact he has offered repeated, clear, factual, and logical arguments for other motivations--is not a good argument.

If you waive all need for evidence, then absolutely anything is possible. We might even get to the point where people say that the jets that were seen by thousands to fly into the Twin Towers are claimed not to have flown into the Towers at all. That would be ridiculous, though, so surely no one would take it to that level of absurdity. Right?

I'm not qualified to comment on the origin of oil, only to say that "scientific consensus" means nothing to me. As a group of people, scientists, like any other group of people, can be contemplated under the lense of sociology (itself as a field subject to its own sociology), and it is a fact that people tend to follow leads. While I wouldn't say that American scientists have clear evidence that the Russians are right, I do think there is a tendency to continue along lines already well marked, than to attempt to brave new paths, fail, and face professional and personal calumny. Most scientists, in my experience, are introverts, and that is not the personality most likely to go around breaking things on purpose just to see what happens. Science happens in a social field, and must be understood as an artifact of culture, not somehow separate from or above it, as some want to argue.

I will add, though, that is is common knowledge in the world of jewelry that there is not a shortage of diamonds in the world. They could easily be made to cost half or less than what they do now, but several familes--De Beers is the one I've heard mentioned the most--control supply.

I don't think Iraq had anything to do with oil, other than an ancillary objective of regional security, itself good for oil supplies.

This is not to say, though, that energy companies don't know things that they aren't telling us. Adam Smith himself pointed repeatedly to the tendency of corporations to want to achieve monopolies, and artifical scarcities. This happens, clearly, and regulation is quite often needed to maintain competition. However, if we could drill for large oil reserves in the United States, I can't see how they wouldn't be cheaper than the oil from Saudi Arabia. We are buying the oil from a cartel that charges what it wants to. If it were produced here, that step would disappear, so I can't see how even the most greedy, self interested corporations wouldn't want that.

Like I said, though, the situation is very complex, and I can't pretend to much knowledge at all.

The earth is not millions of years old, hub, its billions of years old. But thats not the point of this post.

Along the lines of Spider Chick's post, my father has diabetes (including peripheral neuropathy). He refuses to change his diet, although a frank discussion with him last weekend may have changed his point of view. Apparently, the prospect of losing his feet and not being able to enjoy retirement finally got through to him.

Anyway, does anyone have any information or links to places with good information about keeping one's blood sugar in check? I have done plenty of research, but am wondering if anyone else has insight.

Also, some strategies for approaching his diet would help. He is 60 and has been eating like an American for all 60 years...so it must be like the twilight zone for him, having to change his one physical addiction (sugar) just as he's getting ready to retire...he definitely relies on food as his drug of choice, so theres also an emotional and behavioral component to the addiction.

I am finding it difficult to divorce myself from the emotion, and disappointment, that his childish refusal to change his diet has brought about. I know I have to be kind and understanding to a point. And he does not respond well to being told what to do. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.

Did yesterdays wod yest but didn't post...
45/f/130
as rxed:15:22
deep squats
loved this workout. Anxious to do it again after seeing the great times others had. Amazing how well Buddy lees videos work. He simplifies it so well.

From what i see Jason C, you are wedded to the western theory, period. Thanks for a great reply up there Hari it was stated well, where is this magical conspiracy going to come from if the left wins in 08'? who will they blame?

162/m/23

Dynamic Stretch + MCFWU

On to:

For time:

50 Pull up
10 135# DL
35 Pull up
15 135# DL
20 Pull up
20 135# DL

25:48'30

---------------------------------------------------

I feel my lower back, not an injury but more an indication that the WoD stimulus actually stimulated my lower back IMHO eheh
It's only a bit hurting and it feels more like a muscular pain then a nerval ( knife in a wound type of pain) pain , even tho Im not sure.

What would be you guys advise for the recovery? I never remember when to Ice it or actually apply "hot" thing on it.

Any tips/reminder welcomed :)

ah'ouh
ah'ouh

#58 It's hard to say since no one here knows what you need specifically (e.g. what shape you're in, position, etc.) But generally, someone playing a sport like football ought to do some sports-specific stuff which isn't well covered by general work-capacity workouts like crossfit.

Maybe practicing the bio-mechanics of short distance sprinting/lateral movements and higher volume strength days, something closer to a powerlifting workout. General work-capacity is great, but since there's a need for generating tons of energy quickly (and then opportunity to rest for quite a while,) crossfit won't cover your bases ideally. But again that depends on what sort of shape you're in and what your position is.

My 2-cents anyway.

Tim, those 2 websites ARE great...thank you...really cool

Bret,
Sorry,I have no advice for ya , I just really feel for you. It's tough for these old timers to change. I have the same situation w/ my father and its near impossible to accept their lack of interest in their own health.It seems they have to pick up one addiction to replace another. Sugar is one of the toughest.I've tried every angle possible in the hopes something would click but no luck yet. I just know I'm not givin' up on the old man.

Bret #62

The bottom line is until your father decides for himself that he wants to make a change, you're in for a world of frustration. You can't make him change his behavior.
All you can do is point him in the right direction. My father also has diabetes, takes glucophage and all that. I used to preach to him all the time but I never even bring it up anymore unless he or someone else does. Then you can be damn sure I put a comment or two in.
It's very very frustrating to want something for someone else more than they want it for themselves. You can see your way clear to the goal, and they simply don't, or choose not to. I also have a brother who used to be really athletic and now he weighs over 300 lbs. He's 5' 7". Any comment that I make re: fitness, nutrition, exercise, is taken as a personal attack or self-promotion, etc... I happen to know he would love crossfit and I would love to see him get into it, but something has to click within him, the light has to come on, and you can't control when that happens.

Ahh, a rest day. Planning a quick 10 miler on the bike (29er) over at CC. Now that we've had a little rain the trails should be just perfect!

Wow,again Spider Chick,
See there's ALways hope, always. How does it feel to have changed someones life? That is a huge life accomplishment. A day does not go by when I don't thank the Glassmans. All we can do is spread the word. With all due respect to other religions, CF is my 'religion'. Sure I believe in God, but I really believe God helps those who help themselves and CF has given us all such amazing physical and mental results that we want everyone to feel this good.Every thing else falls into place once you acieve that physical and emotional strength. Your neighbor must be on top of the world.

#62 Bret
First of all I am not a doctor or dietitian; just have some experience from what has worked in my family. Take baby steps, don’t try to cut him off of sugar entirely or it will fail. Help him analyze his current food intake and try to carve out 100-200 cals a day. The best way to do this is to keep the intake in number of meals the same but use some portion control and food swapping. Try to get him to food swap some of his sugar snacks (cookies, ice cream, jolly ranchers, …) with fruit that will also help to satiate his sweet tooth but provide healthy benefits. At the same time get him moving, it sounds like he needs some increased circulation and the best way to do this is by moving. With just walking 30 minutes he should be able to burn an additional 80-100 cals. Like Spider Chick help out anyway you can, positive support is the key. If he strays and eats a bag of Oreos don’t get on him just let him know that he will have to work a bit harder to balance out the impact of the cookies to his system. Educate him on how to eat healthy and change the way he shops for food. Again, don’t overwhelm him with change make it a slow learning process and by all means make it easy for him to swallow so to speak.

Good luck … Mike

Spider Chick,
That rocks! 5 weeks, 10#s, 3 dress sizes! Why is it so hard to convince people CF is good for them?
I tried to get my diabetic mom to come in and train with me, loaned her my copy of The Zone... my dad is busy smoking and drinking and gardening. He's fallen into "THE COMFORT ZONE". He only gets defensive when I try.
If someone has a way to reach these people before they get obese/suffer their first heart attack/etc, please let me know.

Worked today:

Six rounds, twelve reps per of:

Bodyweight deadlift (210#)
Pullups
Pushups
5kg ball slams

No time, just working through it. Pretty good workout.

So:
-the Russians are brilliant, and
-the western petroleum establishment is full of bumbling doofuses.

I'm a petroleum engineer, which means that I do not have the same level of geological expertise that Tom has, but I am very familiar with oil and gas exploration activities. The article had nothing in it that gave me any confidence at all that the author had any working knowledge of oil and gas exploration.

I agree with Tom, pseudoscience. It is really just an inflammatory political editorial with no real substance at all, just a bunch of unsubstantiated trite talking points.

Also agree with Coach. It is definitely not written with a conservative slant.

Rest Day Workout:
Rubik's cube solve for time
3 rds
4:34
3:42
2:53

Goal right now is under 2min

Spider Chick,
It has been said already, but awesome story. Very inspirational and I hope that your friend continue her success.

DCJ #70,
Does CC stand for China Camp?

Tim,

thanks so much for those links, VERY helpful, and are now bookmarked on my laptop!

Thanks so much!

Spider Chick,

You're a good woman!

Bret,

You might at least be able to get him to take some good quality fish oil. I believe it helps mute at least some of the negative effects of hyperinsulinemia. In any event, it's otherwise good for your health, and the only potential downside is cost.

Thx everyone. Thx to "Mike in L.A.", our coach at VCF in Van Nuys, CA - the back of the shirt reads "Trample the weak, Hurdle the dead".

I was looking forward to Coach Burgener’s Oly lifting cert that wknd but I hadn't sent in the questionaire. I guess I blew it off since I had sent one in for an earlier date that I had to reschedule. So I knew that I just should've filled it out again, but I procrastinated. When I walked up to the gym in Vista on Sat morning, here’s EvaT sitting behind the table to sign people in. I just kept quiet cause I didn’t want to gush - not that I'm easily starstruck but c'mon she's the original Crossfit superstar - at least in my mind since she was the first image I saw when I found the Crossfit website.

So Eva’s like “hmmmm … hold on a minute” & leaves into the gym. "Oh sh@t" I thought, I never mailed in the questionnaire … I’m gonna get an ass-chewing. She comes out and starts saying "TonyB from Santa Cruz .." & I thought "Oh, HE’s pissed at me" (I had had some posts removed) …. She continues … "according to your email address … You’re InfidelSix, right?" (how'd they figure that out? - I was trying to lay low) "I am." I reply. "Can we interview you this weekend?" I hesitate … "eehhh (weighing the benefits of the low profile) … O.K., ... Do I get to interview you too?" She considers it for a moment "O.K., you can interview me."

I was suprised. Apparently clowning around on the internet at work isn't entirely waste of time.

Spiderchick, awesome story. You & Barry are next. BTW, have you noticed that two of the goofiest personalities here are both Field grade officers (yeah, I just made MAJ)? Stunning. I think if we were ever in the same room it'd be a riot.

Brett--

"I am finding it difficult to divorce myself from the emotion, and disappointment, that his childish refusal to change his diet has brought about. I know I have to be kind and understanding to a point. And he does not respond well to being told what to do."

This is classic. Whether it is you talking about your father, or (I am guessing) your father talking about you not so many years ago.

Think back to when you were 13 or 14, and try to remember how your father persuaded you to change your behavior. Try that approach on him.

I'm not kidding. We're all relucants kids when it comes to change.

Good luck.

I6, good to hear your comments and hey you did a great job interviewing Eva. Awesome question and Eva's even better answer about never getting bored with CF workouts even after 11 years.

What is the Rx'd weight for "Grace"

On my computer, I can only view "Grace-Off" of the 3 "Grace" vid's and it doesn't give the Rx'd weight. Could someone get back w/ me on that.

Thanks in advance

#84 - 135

All, thanks for the tips, please keep 'em coming. I know that if I had to give up my addiction, it would be a serious struggle. So I can see it from my father's perspective. But there comes a time when one has to "sack up" and be a man, and that time has come for my pops.

Still looking for a simple website to help him begin to understand blood sugar and how to control it. Most of the stuff I have found is probably too involved...I want to make it simple for him at first.

Thanks all!

"Grace" as Rx'd: C&J 135#'s, 30 reps for time.

Ah...yeah...methinks 135 is suspiciously close to my 1 RM...Eva is what, 2:49? Yep, yup, yup, yup...there are Crossfitters and there are Eva, Kelly, Annie, Nicole, Jamie, Jolie, Greg, Brendan, Zach...

Fellow Crossfitters,

I'm going to be camping out on the beach for 2 days 2 nights. I'd like to come up with a good "beach WOD." All I will have is my bodyweight and my 115# son. Suggestions would be awesome. I know I can count on you guys to think of something particularly brutal.

Q2,

rx'd weight for men is 135lbs. Not sure for women.

Eva asked me what my favorite workout was. I said "Grace". She asked what my Grace time was. "6:18" - edited out obviously (hey, wait'll next yr). ... so, when she said her favorite WOD was Grace and that her time was 2:34 - I almost fell over.

TomC- thanks for the background science. That saved me several phone calls and a good hour of internet surfing. The story already didn't make sense, but I don't like to raise the BS flag prematurely. I hadn't even considered a boldface lie with regard to the success rate as a possibility until you mentioned it. I like to think that people have at least a little integrity and don't print outright lies, only exaggerations and distortions. Oh well "lies, damn lies, and statistics" right?

Spiderchick - That is AWESOME! I was all proud of myself that I got my [spouse] to try the zone starting tomorrow, but you beat me by a hundred.

Speaking of the Zone, I am now on my second full day. Its lunchtime and yesterday I had already been hungry for 2 hours. Today I was staring at my lunch and wondering how I was going to finish it all. The carb cravings are subsiding apparently.

My theory, for what its worth, on the real rationale for the war in Iraq is that we were spending billions a year on maintaining the No Fly Zones (North and South). President Bush said in his campaign that he wanted to save money by bringing troops home from foreign soil. If he could end the Iraq problem by spending a little more up front then we'd have more money later to lower taxes, pay off the debt, beef up the military, or whatever. Add in the oil, the WMD suspicion, multiple genocides, a perceived link with the 9/11 attacks, etc, its easy to imagine how a morality driven person like Pres Bush would conclude that the war is absolutely necessary. Imagine that, it might have made sense on a bunch of different levels and was neither a corporate profit conspiracy nor a freedom spreading crusade. Of course it didn't work out the way it was supposed to, but how many government endeavers do?

I didn't make this up but I believe it. "Thank God we don't get all the government we pay for."

Barry Cooper -

"Paradoxically, because the explanation involves conspiracy. "They" become the villains, and even though "they" are well entrenched in global power structures, if we can someone get "them" out of power, everything good will happen.

This basic process is likely as old as mankind, and it is a species of deep irony that it is mainly Leftists that want to invoke this "demonization of the Other", when in fact they are generally the principle practioners of it."

It made me laugh because you just demonized Leftists for "demonization of the Other". Pot this is kettle, you're black, over.

-JP

I'm skeptical by nature, and though I find the Zone system intriguing, I was wondering how many of you have found the diet effective and sustainable (or not). I ask because CrossFit is the first sustainable exercise program I have ever found; for me the key is the lack of routine. There is structure but it is never boring; to the contrary, I look forward to the next WOD with great anticipation. Varied workouts are great!

I was doing a semi-fasting diet, based mostly on the Fast 5 diet, but eating an Odwalla protein bar a little before noon before semi-pigging out after 5 p.m. It worked well for me at first, but I need to do something less rigorous, unless I read convincing arguments from someone that saying I should persevere.

My goal is to go from a 36"+ waist to a 32" waist.

A man walked into a very high-tech restaurant in a fancy hotel.
The robot clicked to attention and said, "Sir, there is a one hour
wait.
I am programmed to converse with you until a table is ready, if you
please."

Intrigued, the man said, "OK."

The robot clicked a couple more times and then asked, "Sir, what is
your IQ?" The man answered, "Oh, about 164."

The robot then proceeded to discuss the theory of relativity,
Interstellar space travel, the latest medical breakthroughs, etc.
The man was most impressed.

The next day he returned, but thought he would try a different tack.
The robot again asked, "What is your IQ, sir?
This time the man answered, "Oh, about 100".
So the robot started discussing NASCAR racing, the latest basketball
scores, and what to expect the Red Sox & Yankees to do this weekend.

The guy had to try it one more time. So the next day he returned.
Again the robot asked the question, "What is your IQ?"
This time the man drawled out, " Uh.....'bout 50."
The robot clicked, then leaned close and very slowly asked,

"A-r-e

y-o-u-r

p-e-o-p-l-e

r-e-a-l-l-y

g-o-i-n-g

t-o

n-o-m-i-n-a-t-e

H-i-l-l-a-r-y?"

m/55/198
Live pretty far out in the country, had to go to town to do heavy squats, so I combined 1 rep squats and 1 rep pull ups into a single workout.
Squat to parellel. Rested 2-3 minutes between sets on squats, 2 minutes on pull up. Pull ups were over grip from dead hang.

squats
225
315
365
405
415
425
435

pull ups
50
75
95
100
105
110
115

"In the Valley of Elah" is a deeply troubling film. Supposedly "inspired" by real events, it's a garden variety whodunit in which Tommie Lee Jones plays a retired CID investigator looking to solve the mystery of son's death, just returned from Iraq. But director and screenwriter Paul Haggis, who gave us the justly acclaimed "Crash" last year, has infused "Valley" with a dark, almost strident antiwar message. Haggis would have us believe that duty in Iraq entails performing unspeakable atrocities which twists decent, well-balanced American boys into robotic killers. Of all the GI's in the film, the only one who comes home with any humanity is a drug dealing Mexican gangster who escaped into the Army because it lowered the standards for induction. It's all a downer. Tommie Lee Jones, his face furrowed by age and sadness, delivers short staccato-like bursts of dialouge, his words piercing like Ali's jabs. His grief at the loss of his son is utterly convincing and heartbreaking. He will win the Oscar, bank on it. At the same time, I was angered and upset at what I believe to be a gross misrepresentation of our men and women in the service, and the toxic virus of untruth and propaganda infecting our nation's movie theaters.

I screwed that up didn't I? Its supposed to be "kettle this is pot" because its the pot calling the kettle black. Oh well, I'm just a Marine so these things happen from time to time.

Thanks for the info. No 135's available to me till this weekend. Looking forward to my 1st experience w/ Grace.

Neil(52) & Ellie(52)

Neil

1000 mtr row + 5 min jump rope + Burgener WU

Practice movements for BB Bear session

7 Reps of each x 5 rounds. Weight increase each round

Power clean
Front squat
Push press
Back squat
Back push press

35 kg : 40 kg : 45 kg : 50 kg : 55 kg x 3 reps

Only got to 50 kg last time. Bailed out after 3 reps of 55 kg.
Needed somebody to push me to stay in the game.

Ellie taking the day off.

Have a good one.

Neilfit

Thanks for the "Eva T" interview. It was great to hear from a familar name in the Crossfit community. It would be nice to hear from other crossfit trainers and personalities.

i did the WOD from yesterday this morning, details there. i liked this WOD, but nadia?!!? 7:01?! good god that is amazing!

I6: pleasure to meet you! congrats on the major!

TomC: thanks for the other side of things. crossfit brings all types, doesn't it? its nice to know that if there is a question, on ANY topic, that we can hear various opinions/facts.

SpiderChick: keep up the great work! its so much easier once they see results, isn't it?!

bret: while my dad is not in the same exact boat, i am with you. to some extent, its my whole family (myself included!) we're typical Americans i guess. which also means we are stubborn and the only thing that seems to work is like others have said -- baby steps and unconditional support. no judgement. and lately, example. my parents and brother have seen my own results, discipline and excitement and they get excited, too. it might not be enough to keep them on the horse, but sometimes helps them get back on! good luck, bret. i really wish you the best success!

ck

27/m/186

couldn't rest. 5000m row, 22:57

Tom C - nice rebuttal on the origins of oil.

Regards,

I havent time to read and comment on this article.

But to put the author in context: His book which is a larger account of his thesis is published by Pluto Press, a London based organisation which primarily releases material from a Leftist perspective.

Their blurb says, "He reveals evidence to show that the US and UK decision to go to war in Iraq was not simply an issue of corporate greed. It was a strategic move to control the world economy for the following half century or more."

He has a business background but Neo-con he isn't.

Bret-

Why don't you make your dad a few knock your socks off, low glycemic meals to show him how great eating correctly can be?

Check out Amazon and search for "The Zone." Plenty of "Zone Perfect Meals" type of cookbooks will come up and you can usually pick them up used, at Amazon, for less than $1 each. If you are near one, the local library usually stocks Zone type cookbooks as well.

Tim Hamilton-

One of the worst things I ever did for exercise on a hot beach was run a 5K where we did 10 burpees every two minutes during the last mile or so. I went all out the first two miles and just got killed by the burpees during the third. That last mile ended up taking longer than the first two combined...the light just kept moving down the beach as the two minutes would click by so quickly while I had barely progressed a couple hundred meters before I was face in the sand doing burpees again.

Bret - email on the way from work, I can help, just reply to my home email.

Tom C - awesome post.

Nadia - do what works for you!

Spider Chick - amazing, truly amazing!

I6 - great interview!

#66
thanks for the reply i feel that i and in good shape but not elite. that is what im shooting for. im 21yrs. 5-11 200 and im a runningback, run a 4.6 but my goal is 4.4 by next summer (i play semi pro for the moment) so explosion is key like you were talkin about. i feel that conditioning wise crossfit is helping me out alot but not quit on the power. sometimes im wishin before i check the workout that there is goin to be cleans or heavy squats, but ya i do hill sprints and things of that nature for quick burst, but do you think i would actually have to pay and travel to a crossfit to get the crossfit sports specific workout or find something more for what i need? i really like crossfit tho. its helped me put on size already in just the 3 weeks ive been doin it!

All

Again, many thanks. Angry G, look forward to the email.

I have to keep reminding myself to stay positive, and focus on the successes, and to build each little success into a larger one. Its so easy to be judgmental, but I can't do that. I need to show disappointment when he fails, yet express confidence that he can rebound. In the past I think I have shown more judgmental anger than is healthy.

Addiction is a b!tch.

Its tough because I live 500 miles away, and only see him every few months. Luckily, my brother and mother can help monitor the situation.

JPW,

I thought of that. Reread the post. The problem is not the process, but the content, which should be determined by fact and not hysterical supposition.

I can make my cases. Take any issue, I can present a coherent argument against opposition. The same cannot be said for those who demonize Cheney and Bush.

They can't provide facts to support their case--at least that I've seen in over a year of on-line debates--but keep saying the same things anyway. It's Argument from Insinuation, which I would put into Latin if I could.

Why? It works to rally their troops.

The point is not the tactic, it's the quality of the reference.

#31 J the Bear

http://www.crossfit.com/journal/2007/08/really_cool_homemade_parallett.html

I just bought the materials to make mine today

Since there hasn't seemed to be a counter-argument to TomC i will post someone else's opinion on the matter that i think seems qualified to talk on the subject for a matter of dicussion if anything else..

"Actually I was unaware that any serious proponent of the Abiogenic process of Petroleum formation was claiming that all it took was water, iron, and limestone subjected to high pressures. In fact that rather misstates the serious scientific case. Now I am not a serious proponent of the Abiogenic Formation theory, but coming from a family that has three members in the oil industry who's experience ranges from Wildcatter, to Tool Pusher on an off shore rig, to a Geologist for BP, I am mildly aquatinted with the subject and if they take it seriously, so do I.

The problem I have with most Biogenic Proponents (BPs) is that they talk as if it's a settled bet that they're right. They continually put the onus on the Abiogenic Proponents (APs) to prove them wrong, yet their defense of the Biogenic Process is sketchy at best. BPs argue that the n-alkane series in petroleum has an abundance of odd-numbered carbon chains which is also found in living systems, that the same organic compounds can be found in both petroleum and biological matter, and that there are certain chemicals of a strictly biological origin, biomarkers, found in petroleum that cannot be easily recreated using thermophilic bacteria, and yet if you add a bunch of ferns, lichens, and moss to the mix it all makes sense, and this is proof of the Biogenic process.

All of these arguments can be refuted by pointing out that the abundance of odd-numbered carbon chains is a trait of all linear hydrocarbons, not just organics. That the same organic compounds they claim can only come from organics can also be found in meteorites, and that those biomarkers - often the silver bullet of a BPs argument - are also manufactured by a variety of extremophile bacterium and that at least one biomarker, sterane, is actually the byproduct of a methane eating proteobacteria found deep in the crust.

Let's not forget the "Cool Earth" theory of planetary formation. Recent testing of the oldest rock on the planet, a zircon just over 4.4 billion years old, indicates that the Earth's formation temperature was much cooler than we'd previously thought, in fact it was low enough to allow for the presence of liquid water. The Earth didn't get a "hot" volcanic core until radioactive matter collected in the bowels of the planet. This is supported by the Cassini-Huygens mission to Titan that found an abundance of hydrocarbons present in the form of methane. The "Cool Earth" formation theory supports the Abiogenic Formation theory perfectly. See if the Earth was hot when it was formed, then the methane and other hydrocarbons would have outgassed and been oxidized into carbon dioxide and water and there would be no carbon remaining within the crust, and liquid petroleum would have to be the result of a biogenic process. However if it was in fact cool enough to allow for the existence of liquid water on the surface, then all of the methane and hydrocarbons would have been trapped within the crust and an abiogenic formation process makes more sense.

Robert Robinson, Nobel Laureate in chemistry, studied the chemical composition of liquid petroleum for years and came to the conclusion that it was far to rich in Hydrogen to be of an organic origin: "Actually it cannot be too strongly emphasized that petroleum does not present the composition picture expected from modified biogenic products, and all the arguments from the constituents of ancient oils fit equally well, or better, with the conception of a primordial hydrocarbon mixture to which bio-products have been added." (1963)

And finally like my cousin Jim says, "There are oil fields thought to be played out years ago that now have saleable amounts of oil in them. If it ain't abiogenic someone want to tell me how the Dinosaurs are getting down there?"

It might be seepage, though in some cases there are fields that appear to be refilling from "deep oil" where there are no nearby productive fields.

The thing that get's me going on this subject is that the Biogenic proponents usually adopt this dismissive attitude regarding any Abiogenic arguments. Many Biogenic Proponents belittled Gold's claim that he would find oil drilling as deep as he did in Sweden, and while he wasn't able to sink a commercially viable well he was able to recover 80 barrels of oil before the well became too clogged. Of course the fact that according to Biogenic theory there should have been no oil there at all never get's mentioned.

Also there have been several wells sunk into basement resevoirs in Asia, some drilled directly into granite, and elsewhere around the world.

Personally I don't see why the two must be treated as mutually exclusive. I can accept that liquid petroleum has both a biogenic and an abiogenic origin."

again this is not my opinon but here's the link to where it is posted since theres a lot of dicussion on that page too.

http://www.deanesmay.com/posts/1132682686.shtml

http://www.geoscience.co.uk/geofrc/geobaseasia.html

Tom C - you're the man. I was all ready to post a huge rebuttal, but yours is better. It's pretty easy to spend 2 minutes on google and figure out what's leading scientific consensus and what's crackpot pseudo-science. I'm a betting man, and I'll always put my money on scientific consensus. Anyone wanna bet $50?

BESIDES the point isn't whether or not we're running out of oil. The point is we're dumping so much carbon into our atmosphere that the planet will be unrecognizable in 40 years. Even if the Russians have some voodoo that lets us find 20 gazillion more barrels - we need to stop consuming oil.

Spider Chick - awesome.

Barry,

I actually don't have the attention span to read your whole post even once, but I did scan it again and I see your argument. I am still laughing though.

I6 - Congrats on making 0-4, Have you gotten the neck-hinge installed yet?

JP

26 yom 6'2" 155#

I just had to make up with WOD that I missed.
CFWUx3 minus pullups...subbed back extensions

400m run
50x75# power cleans
40 L-pullups (actually z-pullups)
400m run
40x75# power cleans
30 Z-pullups
400m run
30x75# power cleans
20 Z-pullups
400m run

35:46 All pullups severely broken into 10's and 5's. All runs done on a treadmill....bleh!

Rower: 20 min 342Cal
Stairstepper 20 min 301Cal
Eliptical: 20min 208Cal

25X 135lbs Incline Press
15X 185lbs Incline Press
15X 65lbs One Arm Snatch (ea. arm)
30X V-ups (abs)
3X 205lbs Incline Press
15X 65lbs One Arm Snatch (ea. arm)
30X V-ups (abs)
3X 205lbs Incline Press
15X 65lbs One Arm Snatch (ea. arm)
30X V-ups (abs)
3X 205lbs Incline Press
15X 65lbs One Arm Snatch (ea. arm)
30X V-ups (abs)
8X 185lbs Incline Press
30X 70lbs Toe Lifts
10X 140lbs Calf Raises
8X 185lbs Incline Press
10X 80lbs Toe Lifts
5X 180lbs Calf Raises
8X 185lbs Incline Press
10X 80lbs Toe Lifts
5X 180lbs Calf Raises
8X 185lbs Incline Press
10X 80lbs Toe Lifts
5X 180lbs Calf Raises
20X 135lbs Incline Press
20X 70lbs Toe Lifts
15X 160lbs Calf Raises

20X Box Jump 24"
1min Jump Rope
20X Box Jump 24"
1min Jump Rope
20X Box Jump 24"
1min Jump Rope
20X Box Jump 24"
1min Jump Rope
20X Box Jump 24"
1min Jump Rope

SWIM: 1000 yards

Since I'm going to the mountains this week for a recording session I did 7 sets of 1 rep (max weight) for the Push Press (modelled, of course, after the Weighted Pull-Ups earlier this week).

M/24/140 pounds
All weights in pounds:
85
95
115
115 (form was off on the first one)
125
135
135

New to Crossfit. Does anyone know where to get a set of portable gymnastics rings?

28/f/108

tried the bear today. holy cow still shaking

45-55-65-75-85 (3 sets) the failed -80

pre: mod CFWUx2 + burg
post: shaking

Apollo-
I'm by no means an expert. I don't think they'll make sports-specific crossfit workouts since they love the idea of non-specificity. That works great...unless you play a sport that requires specific skills.

So long and short I have no idea. One thing you can do is cold-email a bunch of strength coaches at universities and ask them what you should do. You'll get a lot of nasty responses, but eventually someone will take pity on you.

I'm not a geologist, but I did understand and enjoy Tom C's post. Three quick points for my two cents:

1) I'm not much for most conspiracy theories due to the fact that I have found the vast majority of them to be incorrect or just plain stupid.

2) What if we did go to Iraq partially for oil? Is that so wrong? Almost every aspect of our lives would be affected from the obvious like getting places, to transporting food and supplies across the country, to basic operation of public safety departments. Our very existence is highly dependent on oil, which in my book makes it worth fighting for. Call me shallow because I enjoy the American way of life, but necessity IS the mother of invention, and someone a lot smarter than I am probably already has an idea for fuel that is actually feasible, affordable, efficient, and won't pollute terribly when it's being produced.

3)It seems everyone is so upset with "big oil" and the obscene(?) profits they were making. I don't consider around 10% profit margin to be obscene. If anyone deserves the ire of US citizens, it should be the government. Congress reprimands the amount of money going to the oil companies, yet overlooks the tax money going into the government's coffers. They didn't drill for it, package it, transport it, refine it, or disperse it, yet they make a killing on fuel taxes. And don't be fooled, not all of that money is going to transportation costs.

Now I'm just waiting for tomorrow's WOD...

Benjamin:

I believe the de-facto store of choice for portable gymnastics ring is here:

http://www.ringtraining.com/index.php

Spider chick, great story. Keep up the good work.
Barry Cooper, John Wopat, you guys are my heroes...

Weighted PU and Squat/JR WOD's done today, results posted there.

I6: congrats!

Spider Chick: very, very nice.

Hi guys,
can you recommend a good site to buy 'home' rings?
Thank you!

As should be obvious, I like researching things like this, and found a link that explains the case for abiotic oil formation in some detail:

http://www.gasresources.net/index.htm

As I understand the issue, their basic argument is that petroleum-like compounds have been repeatedly made in the lab from abiotic compounds, and that supposedly biotic compounds, like amino acids, have been found on asteroids thought to be millions of years older than the first possibility of life in our current understanding of life in the universe.

Moreover, given the irreversible trend towards entropy given in the 2nd law of Thermodynamics, there is no reason to suppose that organic compounds would somehow become MORE complex over time for any reason. What would be required is pressure of such magnitude that it could only exist deep in the Earth, far beyond any possibility of animal remains penetrating.

They deal at some length with the supposed connection of oil with biological markers, as well. It makes sense to me, but I'm no expert.

Here's one excerpt:

"Every compound designated as a “biomarker,” and not otherwise identified as a contaminant, has been either observed in the fluids extracted from the interiors of meteorites, or synthesized in laboratories under conditions comparable to the crust of the Earth, - or both."

It does sound like most of the oil that has been successfully extracted has been found in sedimentary rock. However, what the Russians claim they have extracted was not from sedimentary rock, which would seem to indicate that while we may have found some of the available oil, since we are not drilling to the right depths in the right places, we have missed most of it. That is their argument.

I'd be curious if any of the geologists would take a look at their arguments and tell me what holes they see.

apollo (#104),

If you're looking to drop .2 off of your 40, then you might just want to add some sprint work and practice your starts... a good speed coach can really help wth the starts.

Density training works great on sprints... Let's say 4 days a week, regardless of your crossfit schedule:
- 20 x 20 meter sprints
For the first week or so, alot 30 seconds to perform the sprint and get back to the starting line. Once you drop half of a second off of your average 20-meter time, decrease the time to 25 seconds, then again to 20 seconds at the next .5 second decrease... you can have a friend or coach monitor this closely, or you can go by your own close guestimation, holding a stopwatch.

After about a week of 20-second intervals, increase the distance by 5 meters, and go back up to 30 seconds.... see the pattern?

You should have plenty of capacity as an athlete to add in this work to your training...

Zach

Now I'm caught up. Doubled up tonight on 21-15-9 of hndstnd pushups/ring dips/pushups and 5 rounds of 50 squats / 100 rope jumps

21-15-9 was accomplished in 5 min. on the spot.

5 rounds of sqt / rpjmps was 10:55 min.

Don't know if this is good or bad time.

later,
pb

What are the "specialized conditions" for abiotic oil to form? (other forum). What are the conditions and processes for biotic oil? From my basic understanding, long-chain hydrocarbons don't come easy.
Maybe I should just search around, but it seems like there's some resident experts.

#52 Hari,
If you believe humans impact climate change, then sure. US = biggest polluter, pollution -> environmental damage -> tsunami.

If you don't, famines in Africa arise not only by violent fluctuations in weather, but also fluctuations in the world economy. Since many developing countries are now net importers of food, and don't have many diversified commodity exports, they are particularly vulnerable. How did it get this way?
Well, there are of course many factors, but the US relates by how the world economy has been shaped into what it is today, starting with Bretton Woods. The North/West has largely succeeded at the expense of the South, with a few exceptions. But for the most part, during times of great growth for the North, the South saw little. During times of economic slowdown, the South was in crisis. This is not by chance, but rather affected by international financial institutions, transnational corporations, state relations, and that's just the "large" level.

You guys are the GREATEST! She's lurking on the comments & read all your encouragements... It made her happy, encouraged & has her feeling like she' a part of the Tribe.

I asked her what got her to commit to the life change. She said she was sick of being the fatty.

I have done some nutty things with her as encouragement. Here's some highlights you might like to try with your lab rat:

1). The day she asked for help & training, I demanded her total commitment. I hate to be trifled with, and I hold X-Fit to be sacred. If I'm training someone for free, she's got to "bring it" every time. She agreed. I held her to it.

2). I'm brutally honest. Like Coach Glassman. I never am cruel, but I also don't mince words to spare feelings. Every day's training with the scale. I body fat taped her from the start. I photograph her. She knows it's coming, and that there's no BS. I handed her a 45 lb weight and told her that's what her fat weighs and doesn't she think it's harder to work out with that on her? Then we did some sprint training with weights and worked up to a 100m sprint with 45 lbs in my combat bug out bag. She just died that day. But, that lesson and workout stuck with her. It's a lot more fun to put the heavy stuff down and go light.

3). Everything is recorded every day. I made her a diary. I put in pictures of Selma Hayek, who is her chosen "perfect body". I told her the truth: she could look like that. But, only if she commits body & soul. She writes down her weight, her food intake, how she feels (her knee is all better, but she was getting arthritic and she's still in her 20's).

4). I educated her daily. In addition to the X-Fit WU and the WOD, we had daily education: readings from the CFJ, www.drsears.com, and watching the videos. She imprinted on Annie as the most beautiful and hottest woman in America. So I asked: What Would Annie Do? Just like went wild for Nicole and tried to copy her as much as possible.

5). We used half Cindy as an indicator & measuring tool. We return to that WOD as a measure of her success. It's astonishing and gratifying confirmation that she's getting fitter and fitter.

6). I consulted Tony Young & John Velandra constantly. I didn't want to be mean, but umm... I don't tolerate fat people who say they crossfit. Either she's going to be getting visible, measurable, repeatable results or she's out. I run a lot of my brain waves through them to see if I'm being a jerk and too demanding. So far, so good. And, she said she appreciates my lack of lies or indulgent toleration. She gets what she works for, and CrossFit delivers what I promised it would. Accountability.

7. I emailed her something encouraging every day. Zone info. Consequences of fitness indifference. Sugar addiction info. She said the one thing that really got her attention was a pre-surgical photo of a bloody diabetic foot that was just about to be cut off. I told her that it was her choice, but that foot was a certainty in her future if she didn't change.

8. I praised her for a job well done, & busted her for gluttony. She's got a pair of my Seven jeans in her closet as encouragment. She'll be wearing them by Christmas.

9. She got RESULTS, just like CrossFit produces, and right when I told her she would. I never soft sold it or downplayed it: CrossFit works perfectly. Zone works perfectly. There's no trickery or gimmicks. Your body is a perfect tape recorder. There's no fooling your metabolism, magic pill, blah blah... That's a sales job that always ends in failure. You do CrossFit and eat the zone, you look like the girls on the videos. Period. No lies. Just put in the work, and turn out looking like them. Don't put in all the work, turn out less. Like Coach Glassman said about Greg Amundson: his results are typical, his dedication is not.

10. We went over the sick to well to fit chart from the Cert. I asked her to consider every choice as a sick choice or a well choice. She has come to consider all she does in light of the consequences. We went over metabolic derangement, Syndrome X, and the deadly quartet.

11. and finally, she's really smart. a lawyer. she gets it quick because CrossFit makes sense & works immediately. and, i do live across the street from her and strut around outside on my way home from the gym flaunting my abs & arms & backside. it's a rather undeniable bit of proof that this stuff really really works. Now she's living proof too, and she's well on her way to getting her "Annie" on. Tonight when she was doing her situps, I saw her leg muscles working in her thighs. No jiggly leg fat covering everything, all I saw was just contracting muscles working their way out. It's such a joy.

With the totally reluctant people, ask them to give you just three days. If they crossfit and eat the zone for three days, they will feel so much more healthy. Three little days. If they agree, they're hooked. They can tell from the inside out. At the end of the three days, i then said that if they keep it up for just two weeks, there's no way that they will be able to deny that their body is way fitter and thinner and hotter looking. It will be noticable to others. And, it's true, so why not let them know what CrossFit can do and how effective it is. That's how I got a guy from my office and his wife hooked (umm... that and the bloody foot photo). They train with Ben Kaminski at CrossFit West Chester now. And, they are absolutely different people. Kool-Aid drinkers.

Contagious.

Tjo #102

Thanks for the suggestion. I probably will include some burpees while I'm at the beach.

I think I'm gonna do something like the following:

Three rounds for time:

Pike Press - 10 reps (feet elevated on car trunk)
Power Skip - .10 miles
Tempo Run in shallow water - .10 miles
Fireman's Carry 115# (my son)- .20 miles
20 burpees

If I'm lucky I can find a telephone pole or a log to either deadlift or flip. Luckily most Texas beaches have markers every tenth of a mile. If not I'll just use my GPS.

M/23/6'4"/210

After rugby 10s: 2 rounds (would have done 3 but the gym closed, thankfully) for time of:
50 kb swings (1 pood or 35 lb. dumbbell)
25 box jumps (24" box)

5:43

BRUTAL

I love the interviews.

With apologies and no intention to "hijack" today's discussion, I just discovered that "Atlas Shrugged", the magnum opus of Ayn Rand, was published 50 years ago today.

Thought a few folks here might be interested to know that.

Despite being banged up from double-sessions yesterday and needing this rest day, my work schedule tomorrow will prevent me from getting to the gym.

Decided to try 5 X 5 reps of the "Bear Complex".

Wow, those suck a lot.

65, 75, 95, 105, 110

Turned the last press into a split-jerk just for ha ha's.

#128 Bingo-

"I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man nor ask another man to live for mine."

Howdy Folks,

I excerpted a few posts and respond to them below.

> From CCTJoey #33
> I have read articles lately about, once thought, depleted oil
> fields refilling. Makes more sense to me than rotted dinosour
> parts and other bio-mass. By definition either way it is still
> 'finite' , but to what extent is the point.

This is one reason I took issue with the article's use of dinosaur remains as the primary source of kerogen. Yes, animals can become petroleum, but you are probably not fueling your car with T-Rex's fluid corpse. Instead, think of algae. Algae cover large areas and have a high turnover rate. Fibrous plants tend to become coal. Softer tissues tend to become petroleum. This assumes rapid burial, anoxic conditions, and a whole slew of other special conditions that explain why oil is not found everywhere and why it is a finite fossil fuel.

> From Coach #44
> It is, however, full of liberal nostrums. Full.

The article is primarily filled with stupidity. I'm no fan of our current administration, but his swipes at Cheney were just as silly as his dismissal of modern geologic practice.

> From hub #57
> Another thing the article mentions is an American scientific
> belief that oil comes from old pressurized dinosaurs.
> Personally, I believe in a "young earth", i.e. not millions of
> years old, and (not being a scientist myself) tend to lean
> towards the "Russian" theory that oil is deep, available, and
> abiotic.

See my comment above about dinosaurs and petroleum. With regard to the idea that the Earth is a few thousand years old, I strongly encourage you to critically examine that belief. With just a bit of work, it will become very clear that there is absolutely no evidence that supports such a claim. I will repeat that. The evidence that the Earth's age is approximately 5 billion years is so overwhelming that believing in a young Earth amounts to willful ignorance. Much as CrossFit relies upon evidence based results, so should our views of the natural world.

> From Barry Cooper #61
> I'm not qualified to comment on the origin of oil, only to say
> that "scientific consensus" means nothing to me.

So, does the corpus of information that CrossFit works mean nothing to you as well? Science is a method of getting at some semblance of the truth. It is imperfect, as are all human endeavors. Science, however, relies upon repeatable, observable evidence upon which to draw conclusions. When the evidence points to different conclusions, scientists must change their minds, or cease being scientists. I will address this further below.

> Also from Barry Cooper #61
> While I wouldn't say that American scientists
> have clear evidence that the Russians are right, I do think
> there is a tendency to continue along lines already well marked,
> than to attempt to brave new paths, fail, and face professional
> and personal calumny.

Scientific careers are made by exploding old ideas. Want a Nobel Prize? You don't get one by nodding your head and pretending that incorrect ideas are good. Nowhere else will you find a group of people so hungry to find fault in the work of others as in the scientific community. That does not imply that scientists are perfect, or always right. It does imply that scientists are actively trying to get closer to the truth.

> From Joe M #108
> Robert Robinson, Nobel Laureate in chemistry, studied the
> chemical composition of liquid petroleum for years and came to
> the conclusion that it was far to rich in Hydrogen to be of an
> organic origin: "Actually it cannot be too strongly emphasized
> that petroleum does not present the composition picture expected
> from modified biogenic products, and all the arguments from the
> constituents of ancient oils fit equally well, or better, with
> the conception of a primordial hydrocarbon mixture to which bio-
> products have been added." (1963)

Note the year of that quote, 1963. Robinson's views were not widely held the